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^ 25
KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT
Information Technology Workshop
Monday, February 9, 2004
3:00 p.m.
Commissioners' Courtroom
Kerr County Courthouse
Kerrville, Texas
PRESENT: H.A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1
WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2
JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3
DAVE NICHOLSON, Commissioner Pct. 4
ABSENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge
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On Monday, February 9, 2004, at 3:00 p.m., a workshop of
the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the
Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville,
Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court:
P R O C E E D I N G S
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, this court will
be recessed at this time, and riow we'll open up for the
workshop. It is now 3 o'clock -- excuse me, 3:02,
February 9, '04. Mr. Williams?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Commissioner, we
scheduled a workshop because it's a topic that requires some
looking into. It affects a lot of folks, and I guess we'll
end up determining to what extent we want a policy --
information technology policy and what should be in it, and
so I think everybody -- everybody that's in attendance here
has seen a draft. No?
MS. UECKER: No.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No?
MS. UECKER: No.
no.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No?
MR. HENDERSON: No, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Somebody else said
MR. HENDERSON: I said no, sir.
MS. PIEPER: Would you like me to go make
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some copies?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I got one about 45
minutes ago I'm trying to look at.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I thought everybody
here had a copy.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought -- this may be
a somewhat nonproductive workshop.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's going to be very
nonproductive if you haven't had a chance to look at it.
MR. TOMLINSON: I'd like to say just -- say
something about it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure.
MR. TOMLINSON: There's -- I know there's one
-- the last time there -- the first time it was brought
before the Court, there was an issue about -- about the
ability for -- for someone to monitor the activities of --
of each employee's transmissions as far as e-mail and that
kind of thing goes. I think that was -- that was more
intended for the employee to know that -- that the
department head or elected official had a right to -- to
monitor what activities were taking place in -- on the
individual computers for -- for each office. I don't think
it was intended that -- that we have someone sitting in some
dark room somewhere monitoring every -- every transmission
of every employee. That's --
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Heaven help us, no.
MR. TOMLINSON: And so, I mean, that's not
the intent. And I -- but I -- I think the purpose of -- of
a policy is -- is a vehicle to let new employees know what
to expect and what we expect of them. And that -- that is
when -- when they start work for a government entity, in
that this property is public property, and -- and that
they -- and they need to know what -- how to conduct
themselves accordingly. And I know, from a manager's
standpoint, it's sometimes one -- it's one of those things
that kind of slips under the rug, is you forget to tell
people that this property is public property.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's one of those
issues that I was going to bring up today, Tommy. Let me
read from this policy here. It says -- it's 4.5, Right to
Privacy. It says, Kerr County reserves the right to
monitor, access, review, copy, or delete each employee's
access to Internet and electronic mail, and it goes on and
lists all kinds of little things. That's me reading that.
That means that whoever's in charge of the County is -- I've
always thought for many years the Commissioners Court was,
but I'm finding out that the County Attorney is -- has --
reserves the right to do all those things. So, you know,
maybe you could -- we could add language in there that --
that a department head or elected official has the right --
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah.
MR. TOMLINSON: Well, you know, I mean, you
can't -- I mean, from a technical standpoint, when -- when
Shaun goes to a PC with a problem, I mean, you can't help
but -- but monitor at that point what -- what's there.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I understand.
MR. TOMLINSON: And, so, I -- I look at it
as -- as a notice to the employee that that's -- that's
okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Well --
MR. TOMLINSON: I mean, they can't expect
that their -- their transmissions or their activity to be
solely theirs. I mean, somehow convey that message.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. It's almost
written throughout this thing; it's brought up several times
in -- kind of in that language that you just used. But I
brought it up before, because I'd visited with Mrs. Decker,
and we were talking about there are some things that -- I
think there are some things that nobody else needs to be
seeing. You know, some confidential information, possibly
between Mrs. Decker's office and Sheriff Hierholzer or
something, I don't know. And if there was -- definitely, if
there was going to be a person sitting in some dark closet
monitoring these things, at least that person needs to be
bonded.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I don't think
-- I don't think that's the intent at all. For the benefit
of those that weren't in the -- thank you, Tommy. For the
benefit of those that weren't in the court when this was
introduced to begin with during the budget process, we were
made aware of abuses in our equipment, technology, and so
forth, and the question arose, do we have any policy that
governs these things? And the answer was, obviously, no.
So, I took the liberty of finding a policy -- a very
comprehensive policy, I would add, which was the one that
AACOG has put together over a period of years, governs their
huge computer utilization and technology, and edited and
amended it to fit down to Kerr County, put it on the agenda
with the full view of everybody having an opportunity to
have input into it. Before I did that, however, I ran it by
Tommy for his scrutiny, and Shaun, and then we put it on the
agenda. If it's too comprehensive, then you folks are going
to tell us. If it's too invasive -- although I don't know
how it could be, because they are employees, and it is --
and Kerr County has a right to protect the work that is the
public's work -- you're going to tell me. If, having not
seen it before today, you're not prepared to talk to it
today, then we'll adjourn and come back two weeks from
today.
25 I COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner, I -- I
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think my personal opinion is, it's pretty close. It's got a
lot of stuff that we need in there. It's probably 90
percent or 85 percent to my satisfaction, but I've got -- I
need some more information. I've got some fundamental
questions I need to be answered, and I'd like to ask those
questions at this time.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure, go right ahead.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: First question, if
anybody can help me, is does every office employee in Kerr
County -- every clerical, professional, managerial worker --
have a computer at their desk and have access to the
Internet?
MR. TOMLINSON: Probably 99 percent of them
do.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Is there an
additional charge for each one of those?
MR. TOMLINSON: No. We have a monthly charge
for, you know, Internet service.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. Do -- are we
fairly certain that every employee that has a computer at
their desk needs one to get their work done?
MS. PIEPER: They need a computer, but not
necessarily the Internet.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And that's the way I
Some have Internet access; some don't.
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That satisfies my
curiosity on those things. Just a general statement.
I'm -- I'm pretty -- pretty comfortable with most all of
this, with one exception, and that is that I would propose
that we ban all personal use of computers.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That certainly would
restrict it, and I understand what you're saying. I don't
have a problem with it. I -- are we better served putting
it off for two weeks?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, I think -- because
a lot of people are like me, that 45 minutes ago got this.
I think you're right. I think there's some of us that
could, probably including myself, make some comments now
about some of these issues in it, just so that maybe in the
next two-week period some of that could go ahead and be
worked on. You know, if there were some changes to be made.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All right, Sheriff.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Just quickly. And, of
course, mine, Buster brought up. 4.5, under Right to
Privacy -- and having been someone that has to write policy,
and we're redoing our policy to some CALEA standards, I do
have concerns there. Number one, who is Kerr County? Okay?
Is that our -- is that Shaun, or our technology person? Is
that, you know, Commissioner Williams? Commissioner Letz?
Me?
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's not me, I can
tell you that. But Kerr County is Kerr County.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think there needs to
be some kind of deal, because this is saying that Kerr
County -- and I know your -- what your intent is, but the
way it's written, it opens Pandora's box, in my opinion. It
says, Kerr County reserves the right to monitor, access,
review, copy, or delete each employee's access to the
Internet, and I think that's getting real broad on what all
can be copied off and who can log into somebody else's stuff
and that. And I realize that, back on 4.3, it says, Kerr
County employees and representatives may not attempt to
read, hack into other systems or other people's logins or
crack passwords, breach computer security measures, and all
that. So, it's kind of -- you're giving somebody permission
to totally monitor this. And I think if that permission is
being given, then this permission needs to be given to the
department heads.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think it's implied,
Rusty, that -- that for -- if we're speaking of Kerr County,
in any particular department -- yours is a good example --
we're specifying Kerr County through the Sheriff, who is in
charge of the law enforcement. We're not talking about some
super guru sitting someplace in this building. You are the
man in charge there.
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SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree with you there,
but --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If the County adopts
a basic policy for the use of its information technology,
and it applies to the Sheriff's Department, there is no
other individual in the world we'd look to except you to do
that.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Except for maybe Shaun
or whoever your Technology Department person is.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, he's --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: He takes over -- takes
care of the whole system. That's what I'm saying. I think
it ought to go back to -- the department head may have the
right to monitor and control that, but I don't think "Kerr
County" has the right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't have a problem
with changing the language there. I think the issue,
though, is that the employees need to understand that the
department -- I certainly don't want it the department head
and Shaun, because Shaun -- every time -- Tommy says every
time Shaun goes to work on everyone's computer, he's going
to see that information, and I think that the employees need
to be aware that what they're doing on there is going to be
viewed by Kerr County. And -- and not really monitored, per
se, as in sitting in a black hole looking at all these
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e-mails, reading -- I hope someone has better things to do
than that. But that -- you know, that -- I'd hate for us to
get in a privacy lawsuit because they said, "Well, Shaun
didn't have the right to do it." And that's why I think we
probably need something in our manual that says, yes, our
computer person does have the right to go into your computer
and -- and do things.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Or the department head.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It needs to be at the
invitation, request, whatever, of the department head. I
mean --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The department head has
the authority to allow that person to have that kind of
access; that would be fine. I just think leaving it very
generic, "Kerr County," is way too wide open, in my opinion,
on -- on what can be done. And, like I said, some of this,
we haven't -- nobody's had a chance to really look at that
closely. Now, the one deal I do have a question about is
back on 4.3, it says, you know, where nobody can hack in,
crack passwords, breach computer or network security
measures, or monitor electronic files or communications of
other employees or third parties except by explicit
direction of the Commissioners Court. I don't think
Commissioners Court have that authority to give that kind of
direction. I think if they've got a search warrant from a
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Judge, then that's another deal, but I'm not so sure that
the Court can say that somebody can monitor what's -- what
someone else is doing.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Perhaps not.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But your comment
earlier, and then I'll sit down, about thinking it should be
limited to no personal business on county computers, I agree
with 100 percent.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me offer a
suggestion for the benefit of everybody here. Now that you
have a copy, why don't you mark up your areas of concern and
get them back, and then we'll workshop it when we've seen
them all. I don't think we can do it today, but I
appreciate your comments.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree, but I think
those are some of the highlights.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Where's Shaun?
MR. TOMLINSON: He has a -- he had a prior
doctor's appointment at 2:30. I --
MS. SOVIL: What is the definition of
"employee"? Does that -- does that include elected
officials and department heads, or is it just the employees?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think there are
lots of references in there to elected officials and
department heads and employees and whatever.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the policy should
-- on use should cover everyone. There should -- if you're
getting a paycheck in Kerr County, you're an employee, in my
mind, whether you're elected or appointed.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think it defines
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think it does, too.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- a broad spectrum
of people that it covers.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What I want to see in
the thing -- I like most of it. You know, the thing of --
of downloading programs without permission, all that kind of
stuff, I love that kind of thing. And you need to take a
look at that word, "hack," by the way, 'cause your guru told
you not to use that.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But what I want to see
is that we get away from the -- the spy guy, and give more
control back to the elected official or the department head.
I'm -- and I think it's just a minor tweak here, but the --
the elected officials and department heads are the ones that
should be responsible for running their offices.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- I mean, I
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think you're right, but I think that we have an obligation
to put it into broad parameters, because they may be
responsible for their departments, but if they somehow
misuse this and get the County in a lawsuit, the lawsuit's
going to end up on our desk.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Which I understand.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, I think that it's a
-- you know, we need to have a broad policy and then leave
it to be implemented by the department heads, subject -- I
mean, based on some -- their discretion, and also on their
individual departments. I mean, there's certain departments
that have very different needs and, you know, requirements
than other departments. I mean, anything related to the
courts and law enforcement, they come under all kinds of
stuff that I don't even want to know anything about, some of
their detailed stuff. And lawsuits and juveniles and names
and all -- witnesses, all that kind of stuff, you know,
that's real different than, you know, some communication
that may come out of -- you know, from me to a constituent,
which is, you know, public under a different set of rules.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would refer you to
Item 2, Purpose, and -- one, two, three -- the fourth bullet
down, in which it talks about the applicability of the
policy. And it really -- this gets it right back to elected
officials and department heads. And, you know, that's where
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the enforcement's going to take place, for the most part.
It's not going to take place here.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, but the -- the
only thing I have -- the -- I would agree that the
definitions need to be spelled out, just like who's an
employee, you know. Is that everybody, including the
department heads? But my -- my problem is, if you say this
and say, well, this is just our intent, but we're going to
leave it up to the department head or elected official, you
know, to enforce it, then somebody that comes into office
after you or after me or someone else can say, "Well, I want
it enforced to the letter, the way you wrote it, and this is
what it says." And I think you have to be very careful on
how you word your policy.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Because you have worded
it where that's what it gives -- that's what it says. And
if you, you know, interpret it that way, then you're -- you
can get department heads and everybody in trouble, 'cause
they're not following by the letter.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think there's also --
to me, there's things that have to be done at a minimum
standpoint that is -- is not discretion, like pornography
and -- and, you know, some of this other downloading.
Perhaps this shouldn't be the discretion of everybody. You
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just can't do that.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's true.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But there's other things,
you know, that are in here, so maybe we need a policy that
everyone does this, and then -- but the monitoring and the,
quote, enforcement needs to be done at the -- the -- the
department head/elected official level.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Because then, if y'all
hear that -- you don't think I'm monitoring or enforcing it
correctly, then you can call me before Commissioners Court
and I can explain why we're doing what we're doing, if
that's what it is. But I don't think you can dictate to
everybody else in a r_ertain fashion that --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It's always been
real useful to me to use -- on policy, to use the definition
that says policy is decisions made in advance. So if, for
example, we say in here there'll be no personal use of the
computer, that's a policy. And, as a supervisor, you don't
have a discretion to waive that policy.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That is exactly, you
know, what happens. And -- and in this policy you've
written, to me, that's -- that's exactly what the employee
or -- or, you know, subordinate has to go by. All right?
And if you allow that to be varied any from what you write,
then you've ruined the whole purpose of a policy, and your
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policy is ineffective and can't hold up in court.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What I'm saying, I guess,
when I said -- "discretion" wasn't the right word. What I
was thinking was, that is -- I think we need to do a minimum
standard for the county.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And then each department
can add to that.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: As they need to, based on
their department, is probably a better way. But I think a
minimum amount.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: An example of that is
in the back end here, is the guidelines when writing
e-mails.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's not policy.
That's --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I would add the word
"suggested." Suggested guidelines.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Make it an appendix
so it's clear it's not policy.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And -- you know, and a
department head can take this thing and say, "okay, new
employee, this is how we suggest you write e-mails," or the
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department head or elected official can take it and throw it
away.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Which I would.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We don't want to shout at
anybody.
SHERIFF HIERHULZER: Especially since all our
reports and everything our people do on computer is in
capital letters. Software Group designed it that way.
MS. UECKER: I just have one little comment.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I am shocked.
MS. UECKER: I know you are. You said that
the last time I wanted to make a comment. I think this is
probably good, overall, just looking at it. The only thing
that I -- I would comment on -- I don't really have that
strong of an opinion on it, except that I think we
definitely need to prohibit any obscenities, nudity, I mean,
any of that pornographic stuff. However, I have -- I'm a
little bit concerned about restricting personal use
altogether, because I don't think there's anything wrong
with me e-mailing Jannett saying, "Do you want to go to
lunch?" Which, actually, that would be construed as a
personal e-mail. Also, if -- if one of my staff sits down
and writes an e-mail to a friend during the lunch hour, I
don't think there's anything wrong with that. Now, as far

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as enforcing what the policy is, I -- I was put in a
position to do that just a couple of months ago. I had
someone that I felt like was abusing the policy, and I shut
down her e-mail, and -- for an extended period of time. And
I think we've got -- you know, we sent a message. So, I
think as long as we all understand that we can do that, I
don't think restricting personal use altogether is that --
is a totally good policy. I mean, 'cause if I -- you know,
if I send my sister-in-law an e-mail that says, you know,
"Got a card today," it's not going to hurt anything.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I -- I tend to
agree with Linda on that point, but I also see that as soon
as you open that door a crack, it's real hard to --
MS. DECKER: Right, I understand. But the
way it is right now, the door is open and, you know, the
crack is there. And in one situation -- in one instance in
my office, you know, it was violated, and I took care of it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And that may be
-- you know, you clearly -- well, I don't want to have a
policy for the county that elected officials aren't going to
enforce, 'cause then the whole thing -- you can't
selectively -- either, you know, you can enforce this or you
can't. And if it's no, you end up in a situation -- what
happens -- I mean, are we going to really fire an employee
for -- you know, 'cause Linda let them use their e-mail? I

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mean --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jon, let me read a
paragraph out of the document here. It says --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which number?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 4.4, the second --
there's one sentence and then there's a paragraph that says,
"Limited, occasional, or incidental use of electronic media,
sending or receiving, for personal, non-business purposes
are understandable and acceptable; however, the use of" --
whatever all that other stuff is -- "is prohibited." So,
it's saying there --
MS. UECKER: Yeah, that's good language.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is pretty good.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Let's look at the
next sentence.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: This limited
personal use shall not interfere with job -- job
performance.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: How can it not?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Lunchtime.
MS. UECKER: Lunchtime.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And personal messages
may not be broadcast to groups of people or other employees.
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I think we all know we have some of that. My question is,
do you want it to continue? Mark up your copies. We'll
reschedule -- Ms. Sovil, will you put this back on for a
workshop on the 23rd?
MS. UECKER: About four years ago, I gave --
I don't remember who it was -- somebody in the Commissioners
Court, I gave a copy of a policy, and I thought at that
point maybe then we'd come up with something. I don't know
what happened to it, but it has been --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Here it is. See? Took
four years to get it back.
MS. UECKER: Took four years to get it there.
MS. SOVIL: What about political use? You
know, I have seen some of that.
MS. UECKER: I think that's --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's the same thing
as pornography.
MS. UECKER: Yeah.
MS. PIEPER: I get political stuff sent on to
me, but I don't send it out, but there's nothing I can do.
I mean --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You can't control
what you receive.
MS. PIEPER: Right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But you can control
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what you send.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's true.
MS. DECKER: Well, I have notified quite a
few people on my list to not send stuff to my office, but to
send it to my home instead. So --
MS. PIEPER: But there's only about half that
will comply with your request.
MR. HENDERSON: Yeah, we receive stuff that
we don't have any control over.
MS. DECKER: As a matter of fact, I've got
two senders that I've completely blocked off the computer.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: If you're like me, you
get a whole bunch that you don't solicit.
MS. SOVIL: Yeah.
MR. HENDERSON: Advertisements.
MS. SOVIL: Advertisement for things that you
don't have any use for.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hold it down.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Buster may have a use
for it. Careful, Thea.
MS. SOVIL: I get them too.
MS. DECKER: Are we supposed to forward all
these to Buster if we don't have a use for them?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Williams.
MR. ALFORD: Okay.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Somebody forwarded
them on to me today.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What about -- and I
hadn't -- like Commissioner Williams said, some we don't
look at. But, like, Sheriff's Office has their own web
site. You know, the County has their web site, but the
Sheriff's Office has theirs. You know, that's -- if there
were some things in there -- or you do have employees that
have a radio station that they listen to on it, just out of
speakers of the computer while they're doing their work,
Doesn't interfere with anything. But is that -- a lot of
things that need to be clarified,
COMMISSIONER LETZ; I think --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Streaming audio.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- that kind of thing, to
me, we're getting too detailed. That's up to the department
head -- the department heads, if they want to let the radio
be played,
MR. ALFORD: I'm like Rusty, 'cause Will --
Will, he'll play radio. Does that hurt anything? You know,
that's the -- that, to me, is a question for Shaun. Are we
losing speed by one of our units using the radio? No, it
doesn't hurt anything. I don't mind it, `cause we can't get
radio. We're here on the first floor; we can't get a radio.
MR. HENDERSON: Don`t you have to download
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MS. UECKER: That, too, would be considered
personal use.
MR. ALFORD: It would be.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're streaming, but
it does slow your computer down.
MR. ALFORD: We11, but does it?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think so.
MR. ALFORD: Then on some of these new
ones -- well, it doesn't on ours, but it would on some.
But, again, that's a question that I have, is that -- that
would be personal use.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Is there a way that --
and I don't know the authority of the Court -- that y'all,
as the Court, can make recommendations to the department
heads to actually come up with their written policies in
each department that are subject to approval by the Court,
to save y'all trying to write a policy?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- say that
again, Rusty? I'm sorry.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Is there a way the Court
can make recommendations, get the overall picture out there,
such as no pornography, none of that kind of stuff? I agree
with -- I think we all, you know, wouldn't have any problem.
But, like, our department is rewriting our entire policy
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manual, and the one we have in effect now was approved by
the Court for the Sheriff's Department, and that's that
policy manual, okay? And this will be something that I will
implement in that policy manual as a policy of our
department. And a lot of it we already have in there. Are
we needing to come up with a whole 'pother policy, or is
there a way that, if we have our own, that we can submit
them to the Court and y'all look at them and say, yeah, this
is -- looks okay with us. I don't -- I don't know what your
authority is, other than are we duplicating what the
department heads already have?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me ask you a
question. Wouldn't it be better -- wouldn't it be better --
a better plan to have a basic policy, and somewhere in
there, you make allowances for departmental -- special
departmental considerations?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Would that not be a
better strategy?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't know. See, mine
-- if y'all will remember, we developed a policy and
procedures manual for the Sheriff's office, and it replaced
the County policy and procedures manual that the County has,
the little green book y'all have. Ours incorporated all
that stuff and went into more detail on some of it. But
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it's the Sheriff's Department policy and procedures manual,
and we don't use the green one, and it was approved by this
Court.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess the problem I see
with that one and the other one, I think you need to have a
-- if something changes in the County one, and it`s filed
and it's, you know, important for all County employees, that
needs to get into that other one if you`re doing a different
manual. And I think the more different manuals you have,
the more chance of us having conflicts and problems, so I
think the Court needs to have a -- on this issue, anyway, a
basic policy, and if each department wants to make it, you
know, more stringent or -- than that, that's fine. So, I
think the basic part should apply to, really, all employees,
such as the pornography and some of the --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- other stuff. I mean,
I just don't see there's any reason for -- unless that's
just not acceptable.
MS. UECKER: I don't think it -- yeah, I
don't think a general policy like this would prohibit any of
us from adding to it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct.
COMMISSIONER LETZ; Correct.
MS. UECKER: Which is basically what you've
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done.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's exactly right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think you're right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But we don't want to
build something that is -- that interferes with a particular
office, an individual office of same sort. But I think if
we can figure out a way to get that basic thing down, the
downloading and the pornography and all that, all those
issues, if we can get that stuff down, then let the
department head take care of their own business.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Well --
MS. UECKER: I have one other thing that I --
I'd like to ask, and I don't know; this might need to be
directed to Tommy. We had heard that there's possibly plans
to discontinue the WinPop -- whatever that little deal is.
Tommy? Is that --
MR. TOMLINSON: That's optional to the
individuals.
MS. UECKER: Okay.
MR. ALFORD: If I can address that a little
bit --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't know what
you're talking about.
MS. SOVIL: I took it off of mine.
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MR. ALFORD: On the WinPop, the majority of
the county computers operate on Windows '98. WinPop -- I'm
sorry, Windows -- WinPop is internal.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We don't care.
MR. ALFORD: Okay. It is -- the new version
does not have Windows popup.
MS. UECKER: Is there anything similar to
that that it would have?
MR. ALFORD: Well, it does, but Shaun and I
talked about it; you get into an open records problem about,
was it a message that's subpoenable under Open Records?
MS. UECKER: Well, the whole computer is;
that's not an issue at all.
MR. ALFORD: Okay. I'm just trying to answer
your question.
MS. UECKER: I know.
MR. ALFORD: In other words, no. It's -- you
don't have access to it after you upgrade your Windows. Now
then, yes, you can purchase an application that will allow
you to do it, and yes, it is cheap, and yes, the County can
do it. But as of right now --
MS. PIEPER: In that instance, though,
instead of doing that and going through all that expense,
you could use the Messenger.
MR. ALFORD: Well, but this prohibits any
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messenger -- any MS Messenger and --
MS. UECKER: That's what I'm talking about.
MR. ALFORD: WinPop, like in the -- like
under these guidelines, it's prohibited, because -- reason
being is, how long domes it take you to type an e-mail?
What's the difference between a regular e-mail message and a
WinPop message?
MS. UECKER: Quite a bit, depending on the
application.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Hold on.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Let's adjourn.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll come back for
one more discussion. Mark your copies and return them to
Ms. Sovi1, and we'll try to -- we'll try to put same sense
to them.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Anything else?
Anything else, Mr. Williams?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, sir.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I declare the workshop
adjourned.
(Workshop adjourned at 3:35 p.m.}
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STATE OF TEXAS
COUNTY OF KERR
The above and foregoing is a true and complete
transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as
County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County,
Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth.
DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 17th day of February,
8 2004.
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JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk
BY: `
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Kathy Ba k, Deputy County Clerk
Certified Shorthand Reporter
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