1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, April 23, 2001 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: FREDERICK L. HENNEKE, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 LARRY GRIFFIN, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X April 23, 2001 PAGE 2 --- Visitors' Input ................................... 3 3 --- Commissioners' Comments ........................... 5 4 1.1 Pay Bills ........................................ 35 1.2 Budget Amendments ................................ 41 5 1.3 Late Bills ....................................... 45 1.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports ............... 13 6 2.1 Approve Assignment & Assumption of lease 7 agreement between KX Aviation, Lessee, & City of Kerrville/Kerr County, Lessor ............ 14 8 2.2 Approve joint City/County resolution supporting Entitlement Grant for T-Hangar paving ............ 17 9 2.3 Clarification of Mobile Home Rental Community Rules and application thereof .................... 21 10 2.4 Final revision of plat, Lots 231-239, Northwest Hills, Phase II .................................. 30 11 2.6 Authorize hand check for reimbursement of money to Kerr County Republican Party for overpayment 12 of election services ............................. 32 2.7 Authorize purchase of scanning equipment to 13 replace existing files in Voter Registration ..... 46 2.5 PUBLIC HEARING, revision of plat for Tract 16, 14 Silver Hills Subdivision ......................... 53 2.8 Discussion regarding provision requiring OSSF 15 application/installation on property within a platted subdivision prior to utility hook-up ..... 69 16 2.9 Changing FLSA status on job description for Information Systems Support Specialist ........... 82 17 2.10 Resolution proclaiming May 3, 2001 as National Day of Prayer .................................... 83 18 2.11 Approve payment from excess Capital Outlay funds for Thermabind machine for District Clerk ........ 84 19 2.19 Approve 4 Certificates of Substantial Completion relating to the courthouse annex renovation, 20 authorize the County Judge to sign same .......... 86 2.12 PUBLIC HEARING, amendment to Kerr County OSSF 21 order regarding property transfer inspections .... 90 2.13 Approve amending Kerr County OSSF order regarding 22 property transfer inspections & procedures ....... 97 23 --- Commissioners Court recessed .................... 118 24 25 3 1 On Monday, April 23, 2001, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Good morning. It's 9 o'clock 8 on Monday, April 23rd. We'll call to order this regular 9 special session of the Kerr County Commissioners Court. 10 Commissioner Letz, I believe it's your turn. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If you'll please stand 12 and join me in prayer. 13 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. At this time, any 15 citizen wishing to address the Court on an item not listed 16 on the regular agenda may do so. Is there any citizen who 17 would like to address the Court on an item not listed on the 18 regular agenda? Once again, is there any citizen who would 19 like to address the Court on an item not listed on the 20 regular agenda? Sir? 21 MR. KEITH: I'd like -- 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Come forward and identify 23 yourself. 24 MR. KEITH: I would like to mention the fact 25 that I'm not -- I'm -- not for another reason, but I -- at 4 1 Oakwood Mobile Home Park, you know, behind Greenwood Forest, 2 we got a problem out there. I don't live there, but I have 3 a mobile home there. And, it happens to be at 113 Ash. I 4 own the one at 115 Ash. And the one at 113 Ash is becoming 5 a junkyard. It's -- there's all kinds of vehicles there, 6 all junk and everything else. Now, Mr. Holekamp has been 7 working on it, but, you know, I'd like to -- and I think 8 that he's written them a letter and they won't answer it, so 9 I don't know what the next step is going to be. But, it's 10 nothing but a junkyard. There's seven vehicles there all 11 tore apart and whatnot. And I know, according to some of 12 the deeds, that only two are supposed to be -- and they're 13 supposed to be licensed. So, I'd like, you know, you guys 14 to think that -- you know, think it over. But I'm not here 15 for that reason. I just wanted to mention it. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Could you give us your name 17 for the record, please? 18 MR. KEITH: George Keith. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay, Mr. Keith. 20 MR. KEITH: And I own a mobile home at 115 21 Ash. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay, thank, you. 23 MR. KEITH: The lady that lives there took 24 care of my wife for six years before she passed away, and so 25 I got a feeling for her. And she's -- can't get it 5 1 straightened up, she's going to move. Well, that puts me in 2 a bad spot, too. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay, thank you. Anyone 4 else? If not, we'll go to the Commissioners' comments. 5 Commissioner Letz? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess I'd like to 7 publicly offer my condolences to the Schreiner family for 8 the passing of Charlie III yesterday. Tremendous loss to 9 the community. And also, I mean, for the loss of Louie a 10 little over a week ago, especially difficult time for that 11 family. And, on that same note, I really -- it's just -- 12 many people are aware that Chrisie, Louie's wife, asked that 13 the donations in Louie's honor be given to Kerrville Little 14 League. And, I'm not -- at this point, I don't want to give 15 out an amount, but the amount of donations are phenomenal. 16 We're astounded, the Little League, at the amount of money 17 we are receiving. A lot of them are in pledge amounts, so I 18 hate to -- till we get them in, I hate to actually say 19 anything publicly until we get the full amount, but it's a 20 great, I guess, sign of this community to have the 21 generosity they do. The amount of funds really is truly 22 remarkable. And, on a little bit lighter note, I don't know 23 if these rains may change the plans, but anyone who has 24 nothing to do, it may be interesting to go down to Hermann 25 Sons and watch them try to hoist a 90-foot railroad car 6 1 across the river. 2 (Laughter.) 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It will be Aggie 5 engineering at its best, so we'll see how that works. But, 6 with the flow of the river rising a little bit right now, 7 they may decide to postpone that; I'm not sure, but I know 8 that the -- the creeks are down -- or up this morning. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Be sure and let us 10 know. I know we'd all like to go attend. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: See a great freight 12 car raising. That's something else. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's all I have this 14 morning. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Commissioner Griffin? 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Nothing to add. I 17 certainly have the same thoughts about the Schreiner family, 18 and I think that Jonathan's pretty well said it all. Very 19 well said. That's all. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Baldwin? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. I just 22 wanted to really say thank you to my colleague at the other 23 end of the table. A couple years ago, he was approached to 24 be a judge at a dog I dog show and was unable to attend, 25 asked me to sit in for him. And I did my second year this 7 1 year, Commissioner, and I want you to know that -- well, I'm 2 just going to stop there, because the English language does 3 not lend verbiage. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I know how -- how 5 honored you must be. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I am, and it's a 7 great, heartfelt thanks to you. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. Quite welcome. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's all. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Williams? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Your reputation 12 precedes you, because I heard about your performance out at 13 the Kerrville Air Show on Saturday, and you were nowhere 14 near there. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wasn't even there. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Again, I echo 17 Commissioner Letz' sentiments. Condolences to the Schreiner 18 family on the loss of two of Kerr County's finest people 19 here within just a very short period of time. That's tough. 20 I'd like to also commend the -- those who were sponsoring 21 the various forums here recently. Kerrville Daily Times 22 sponsored one for the Headwaters folks, and I believe the 23 League of Women Voters sponsored one for the City Council 24 candidates, and the Center Point Alliance for Progress 25 sponsored one for the -- their school district Board of 8 1 Trustees, as well as the Headwaters candidates, all of which 2 had reasonable attendance. But, I think more importantly 3 than the reasonable attendance was the fact that, at each of 4 those instances, there was an opportunity for a candidate to 5 express themselves on the important issues of the day. And 6 the important issues of the day in terms of the Headwaters 7 are significant. There are significant point-of-view 8 differences, but that's what forums are all about, to help 9 the public sort out the answers. They were all very good. 10 Appreciate those efforts. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Like all of us, we are deeply 12 saddened by the loss of Charlie III as well as Louis 13 Schreiner in a short period of time. I think it's within my 14 authority that when we get notice of Charlie III's funeral, 15 we'll ask that the flag here at the courthouse be lowered to 16 half-staff during the -- during the service. Small token of 17 our appreciation for all that Charlie III, himself, and his 18 family has done for Kerr County and the Hill Country. I'd 19 also like to extend my congratulations to Raymond Holloway 20 for being chosen Fire Chief of the Year. Raymond, as we all 21 know, works hard around here. He's actually the Emergency 22 Coordinator for Kerr County; very happy to delegate that 23 authority to him. He has been very instrumental in the 24 excellent EMS and First Responder services that we enjoy 25 here in Kerr County. So, our congratulations to Raymond for 9 1 an honor well deserved. I'd also like to thank and 2 congratulate the various departments here in the courthouse 3 for the excellent displays which are out in the halls during 4 County Government Week, as it's instrumental for me, as well 5 as for everyone, to go by and see how things used to be done 6 and what -- what the various departments do. And I want to 7 thank the department heads and all of the people who worked 8 on those displays for their initiative and creativeness and 9 willingness to keep County government alive and fresh for 10 all of the citizens in Kerr County. 11 In keeping with that, I'd also remind 12 everyone that this Friday is Kerr County Heritage Day, and 13 we'll be having a number of exhibits out on the courthouse 14 lawn about the heritage of Kerr County, including 15 sheepshearing, forging, in the sense of making iron. We 16 have a -- we'll have a longhorn here from the Y.O. Ranch. 17 We have people cooking over an open campfire, and a number 18 of exhibits that are going to be very interesting. We know 19 that the 4th graders from the Hunt School are going to be 20 visiting and will be serving as shadow officials that 21 morning. And, the video tape -- the Video Tech Department 22 from Tivy High School is going to come and film the -- the 23 exhibits and the events, and it should be a very good day. 24 We hope everyone will turn out and help us celebrate Kerr 25 County Heritage Day. That's this Friday, the 27th. 10 1 Finally, before we move into the regular 2 agenda, we do have an Executive Session planned for today. 3 We'll have that this morning, immediately after we conclude 4 the regular business, before we break for lunch and our 5 workshops this afternoon. So, we'll keep that in mind. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I have one other 7 announcement that I forgot to mention. I'd like to -- I 8 don't know if everyone's aware of it. I'm sure it will be 9 in the paper, but N.R.C.S. is putting on a seminar geared 10 for the -- for property owners of small tracts of land. 11 It's geared for people -- people that own from 1 to 100 12 acres, something I think that's been needed for a long time, 13 to try to help a lot of these -- I guess a lot of the growth 14 we see are people that are buying small tracts in this 15 county, and a lot of them don't have much information 16 available to them on how to -- what to do with their 17 property. So, N.R.C.S., along with Texas A & M, is putting 18 together a workshop held at Lion's Camp that day. I've been 19 asked to be one of the speakers, talking about land ethics 20 and stewardship. Bob Dittmar is another local individual 21 who's going to be speaking. 22 AUDIENCE: When? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When? It's May 12th. I 24 believe it is a Saturday. Anyway, it should be -- they have 25 a number of other speakers that -- probably 10 to 12 11 1 speakers, and it should be a -- you know, the agenda looks 2 very interesting. It should be a real good program for 3 people that don't have a lot of land, but do want to manage 4 it properly. 5 MS. SNYDER: Could that possibly be videoed 6 so it will be made available to the public other than just 7 the hearing day? I'm going to be out of down that day. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I will talk to N.R.C.S. 9 about that. I wouldn't know why they wouldn't -- maybe Tivy 10 High School or someone -- Channel 51 or someone may be 11 interested in doing that, or N.R.C.S. may have the 12 capability. But, it would be an interesting thing. I know 13 all the talks are being made -- they are going to be 14 compiled, made available to people, but I think the video -- 15 that would be a good idea, as well. I'll mention that to 16 Joe Franklin. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Two other quick things which 18 I'll mention. There is a free grant-writing workshop this 19 Thursday and Friday at the Butt Holdsworth Library. It's 20 being sponsored by Kerr County and the Alamo Area Council of 21 Governments. Excellent opportunity for any government 22 agencies or foundations or several organizations to go and 23 get real good training on how to write grants and how to 24 seek out grant monies. Also, there is a regional airport 25 meeting put on by the Texas Department of Transportation 12 1 this Thursday at 9 o'clock. It's going to be at the Main 2 Street building down on Water Street. We have posted that 3 as a Commissioners Court meeting, so that any and all of us 4 who wish to attend may do so. But, that meeting is at 5 9 o'clock on Thursday morning of this week, the 25th. Okay. 6 Anybody else have their memory jogged? Okay. 7 MR. KEITH: Could I -- could I put a plug in 8 for the EMS/fire department? 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sure. 10 MR. KEITH: I was transported to Methodist 11 Hospital a few months ago, and we got as far as Boerne, just 12 by this side of Fiesta. So, the man that was in back with 13 me said -- says, "We got to stop. The driver said we got to 14 stop." Well, a pickup went by, turned over, and spread 15 three kids over the street and whatnot, and so the man in 16 back said, "Hey, are you all right?" I said, "I'm fine. 17 Get out here and help them." So, he stayed with them until 18 the people got there, but he had to cut the britches off of 19 one boy. And the boy that was driving the truck, he stayed 20 with me. So, I was going for a heart attack, but somebody 21 was lying there in the street. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, thank you, Mr. Keith. 23 We appreciate that. Let's pay some bills. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, Tommy told me 25 out in the hallway -- you were busy. He is -- has computer 13 1 problems. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We can go ahead and do 4 it, if you'd like, or he -- or put it off for a little while 5 until he can get in here. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Does anyone have any 7 questions or comments? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yes, I do. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, then, we'll put it off. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: And we'll put off the budget 12 amendments, as well. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: And late bills. Okay. We'll 15 come back to those at a later time. At this time, I'd 16 entertain a motion to approve and accept the monthly reports 17 as presented. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 21 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve and 22 accept the monthly reports as presented. Any further 23 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 24 right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Okay. 4 Starting with our consideration agenda, Item Number 1 is 5 consider and discuss approval of Assignment and Assumption 6 of Lease Agreement and a Fifth Lease Addendum to that 7 certain lease agreement between KX Aviation, Lessee, and 8 City of Kerrville and County of Kerr as Lessor. Megan? 9 MS. CAFFALL: Good morning. Mr. Robert 10 Woodward, who owns Kerrville Aviation, Inc., has listed the 11 business for sale. Kerrville Aviation, Inc., has two 12 airport ground leases currently combined in the site; the -- 13 the original fixed-base operator, KX Aviation, lease, which 14 includes Lot 3, part of Lot 2, and the S & S Aviation lease, 15 which includes Lot 9 and Lot 10 out of the ramp at the 16 airport. The KX Aviation lease term runs through 2013, with 17 options for two 10-year extensions at negotiated terms. And 18 the S & S Aviation lease expires in 2005, with no options 19 for extension. Mr. Joe Kennedy, owner and General Manager 20 of JLK Enterprises, Limited, has made an offer to purchase 21 the business from Mr. Woodward, has obtained financing, and 22 is requesting that the KX Aviation and S & S Aviation 23 airport ground leases assigned to Kerrville Aviation, Inc., 24 be assigned to JLK Enterprises, Limited. City and County 25 staff have reviewed JLK Enterprises, Limited's summarized 15 1 financial information and business plan, and have no 2 objections to the assignment of leases to JLK Enterprises, 3 Limited. Mr. Kennedy has worked for Kerrville Aviation for 4 nine years, and has been the General Manager for the past 5 six. The Kerrville/Kerr County Joint Airport Board 6 recommended that the KX Aviation and S & S Aviation airport 7 ground leases be assigned to JLK Enterprises, Limited, at 8 the April 11th meeting. 9 It was kind of interesting -- this is 10 Mr. Kennedy right here. At the air festival on Saturday, we 11 had a -- a brief ceremony to award a commendation -- or to 12 just express our thanks to the group that helped fight our 13 fires last Labor Day, and we put together a -- just a 14 regular commendation thing which the Judge signed and the 15 mayor signed, and I had it framed and -- and we thought we 16 were doing pretty well, until they came and -- and said, "Oh 17 this is really great." You know, "We'd love to come back 18 here; y'all treated us so well. We have a presentation that 19 we'd like to make to Kerrville Aviation because they treated 20 us so well, and made it really much better for us here than 21 we've ever had it anyplace else." And they put out the 22 presentation that has their Firehawks patch and a picture of 23 the Blackhawk actually dumping on the fire that -- that the 24 Times had sent them, and an engraved brass plaque, and it's 25 all matted and framed. And, it was really nice; I was very 16 1 impressed that they recognized Kerrville Aviation. It is -- 2 Kerrville Aviation is the Kerrville airport. When you fly 3 in or land there, the City and County representatives aren't 4 there; we are represented by Kerrville Aviation. And, as I 5 travel over the state, we -- I hear constantly compliments, 6 including from my dad, who's one of the pickiest people in 7 the world. But, he flew here. So, anyway, the 8 recommendation is from the Airport Board, that the leases be 9 assigned. The provisions for -- in the lease say that they 10 should not be unreasonably withheld. Assignation is 11 something that's provided for in the leases. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions or comments? 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'd just like to make 14 a motion that we approve the assignment and assumption of 15 leases as presented, and with the comment that -- that Joe 16 Kennedy has done a fantastic job as General Manager of 17 Kerrville Aviation, and I would expect to see many great, 18 great years for the airport. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second the motion. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 21 Griffin, second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 22 approve the Assignment and Assumption of lease agreement and 23 the Fifth Lease Addendum to that certain lease agreement 24 between KX Aviation as lessee and City of Kerrville and 25 County of Kerr as lessor. I will note for the record that 17 1 the documents have been reviewed by the County Attorney's 2 office and they have no objections to the form and substance 3 of the assignment. Any further questions or comments? If 4 not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 9 2, consider and discuss approval of a joint City/County 10 resolution in support of an entitlement grant for T-hangar 11 paving, and authorize County Judge to sign same. Once 12 again, Megan Caffall. 13 MS. CAFFALL: Recently, Congress passed and 14 the President signed some new legislation that provided for 15 grant funds specifically entitled for approximately a 16 hundred airports across Texas. And, in past years, 17 entitlement funding has only gone to airports that have 18 passenger service. It's based on how many seats you sell a 19 year. And, these funds are entitled; they're given to you. 20 You can use them for anything that is approved for airport 21 improvement projects. They just started making these funds 22 available for general aviation airports like ours. And, of 23 course we indicated a desire that we wanted some of these 24 funds. Kerr County Airport is eligible for entitlement of 25 $150,000 for this year. We also will be allowed those funds 18 1 for the next two years if the funding is made at the 2 beginning of each year, but we definitely have it for this 3 year. And, the match from the City and County is $16,667. 4 I have no idea how they come up with these numbers, but 5 that's what they -- you know, our share is supposedly 6 10 percent of $150,000, but the paperwork that they sent us 7 said that your share will be this and the total project will 8 be $166,667. We had already planned in the airport budget 9 for T-hangar paving, the majority of which we had included 10 in our airport budget. It wasn't going to be fancy paving; 11 it was going to be just enough to get us going because of 12 the budget strain this year of building those T-hangars, so 13 this really is a blessing. And, the grant match here is 14 less than the grant funds that I had planned to spend on 15 this project, as well, on the paving, which was $20,000. 16 So, I'm anticipating that this grant will put us in a better 17 position at the end of the year, retaining some of the money 18 that I had planned to spend on paving in our fund balance. 19 So, all in all, it's a very good deal for the airport and 20 the T-hangar project. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Questions or comments? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I would move 23 adoption of the joint City/County resolution in support of 24 entitlement grant for T-hangar paving, and authorize the 25 County Judge to sign same. 19 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 3 Williams, seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court 4 approve the joint City/County resolution in support of the 5 entitlement grant for T-hangar paving and authorize the 6 County Judge to sign same. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a question. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions or comments? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a question. Is 10 the total project $150,000 or $166,000? 11 MS. CAFFALL: $166,000. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I third that motion. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 14 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 19 MS. CAFFALL: Could I make another 20 announcement while I'm up here anyway? Put the other hat 21 on. April is Clean Up Our Act month here in Kerr County and 22 Kerrville, and we are having our hazardous waste collection 23 on Saturday from 9:00 to 1:00 at the Community Recycling 24 Center. I have some funds available and we have declared 25 that day and that time period, from 9:00 to 1:00 at the 20 1 Recycling Center for tire amnesty day. We're going to 2 take -- not from businesses, but from individuals or people 3 in the county that have accumulated -- accumulated more than 4 four tires, which is what we normally limit our collection 5 to, we'll take, within reason -- I mean, we're not going to 6 take semi truckfuls of tires from people, but we will take 7 as many tires as people bring in. So, just pass the word 8 along, and also as well, our regular hazardous waste 9 collection, but tires are a real problem here in the city 10 and I'm sure they are in the county also. It's gotten very 11 difficult to dispose of them. They charge $2 a piece at the 12 landfill. My cost will be about half of that per tire to 13 get rid of them, but myself and the City Manager feel that 14 this would be a good -- good one-time opportunity -- we're 15 not going to be able to do this every year, but a good 16 one-time opportunity to get some of these tires gone. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are batteries included in 18 hazardous waste? 19 MS. CAFFALL: Yes, sir. They actually are 20 recycled. Rice and Murayama Radiators will take batteries 21 anytime. They come to our events and take all the 22 automobile batteries and recycle them. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you very much. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Next item for consideration 21 1 is Item Number 3, consider and discuss a clarification of 2 Mobile Home Rental Community Rules and application thereof. 3 Franklin Johnston. 4 MR. JOHNSTON: This has come up -- there's 5 been a couple situations arise, one in Precinct 4 and one in 6 Precinct 2, where there's been more than one mobile home on 7 a lot. Some lots aren't platted, but they're -- they're 8 acreage-type lots. And the question arises, does two mobile 9 homes on a lot constitute a manufactured home community? Or 10 is it just -- especially if they're used for a family member 11 to live in, like a -- a parent or a child? U.G.R.A. had 12 the -- they defined the ordinance as more than one. They 13 won't approve septic permits. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think we have to look at 15 what the definition is. It's not a manufactured home 16 community; it's a manufactured home rental community. 17 MR. JOHNSTON: Rental. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Either the lots or the 19 manufactured homes have to be held out for rent -- 20 MR. JOHNSTON: Right. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- in order for it to qualify 22 for it under the requirement for minimum infrastructure 23 standards. 24 MR. JOHNSTON: I think, in this case, one 25 person owns both homes, and they -- they're probably renting 22 1 to the other one, but they claim in their letters to family 2 members. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- I mean, the -- 4 going a step further from what the Judge said, to me, you 5 would have to rent two of them. I mean, if you own one and 6 rent one, that doesn't qualify. You have to rent two, to 7 have two rental spaces. I mean -- and, to me, I mean, I 8 don't think that -- I think, to me, it does not qualify. I 9 mean, you've got to hold -- 'cause it says two or more 10 spaces that are rented, so if you own one and rent one, that 11 doesn't qualify. If you own one and rent two, then it does 12 qualify. It depends on, you know, the -- if you're renting 13 two of them, yes, it does qualify. It depends on what 14 they're renting. I mean, the fact that there's mobile homes 15 there is irrelevant. I mean, it's how many rental home -- 16 mobile home spaces they're renting. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What if they're 18 renting two to family members? 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Still a rental. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Still a rental. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's included, then, if 22 there's a house on the property and they rent two to family, 23 that's a community? 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I don't believe there 25 are -- in either of the cases that we're talking about, that 23 1 that's a problem. On one metes and bounds piece of 2 property, there is a -- a residence plus two rental mobile 3 homes. I don't think that's the case in -- 4 MR. JOHNSTON: One of them has two extra 5 mobile homes and one of them's not -- they say it's not a 6 rental. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's just like -- 8 let's assume that it's not mobile homes we're talking about, 9 but -- but fixed structures. Now, I can build a guesthouse 10 on my property if I want to, as long as I can get it past 11 the hookup requirements for a septic system and good water 12 to it and that sort of thing, but that has -- as long as I'm 13 not subdividing the property, then I don't think there's any 14 mobile home rental community, unless there's more than two 15 rented on the same piece of property, so I think the answer 16 to the question here is no. Now, I mean, I think -- this is 17 not a mobile home rental community in either of the cases 18 that we've looked at. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: These definitions are state 20 definitions. 21 MR. JOHNSTON: Mm-hmm. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Has to be at least two that 23 are held out for rent. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is there any 25 difference in whether you -- you own all the mobile homes 24 1 there and you're renting the mobile homes, or you are 2 renting a space? Is there a difference in those two things? 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: No, not by the definition. 4 Either of those circumstances is a rental home -- 5 manufactured rental home community. 6 MR. BARRON: Judge, what if -- 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Come forward and identify 8 yourself, sir. 9 MR. BARRON: Stuart Barron with U.G.R.A., 10 Upper Guadalupe River Authority. Some of them have been 11 represented to us that they're just going to give them the 12 house to live in, without collecting rent. Is there 13 anything that stipulates that what -- new mobile homes and 14 new septic systems? 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Once again, under the law 16 that we're working with, it says these have to be rented. I 17 don't know what the exact language is, but it's -- 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think the answer to 19 that question, Stuart, is that -- is that you would have the 20 same ruling on your question as you would if it had nothing 21 to do with mobile homes. 22 MR. BARRON: Yeah, exactly. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If I build a home on 24 property and give it to somebody to use, there's no 25 restriction in our Subdivision Rules that would keep me from 25 1 doing that. Now, I would still have to meet the -- the 2 O.S.S.F. requirement for having enough space for a 3 drainfield or use a cluster system or whatever, but the fact 4 that it's a mobile home -- 5 MR. BARRON: Yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- wouldn't have 7 anything to do with it. 8 MR. BARRON: I agree completely with that. 9 One of them that's in question is actually plotted as a 10 mobile home rental community with KCAD, and maybe that 11 hasn't been switched yet. There's actually three -- these 12 happen to be mobile units out there right now. She said one 13 of them's just going to be storage, and the other two are 14 going to be -- I don't know if she said they were going to 15 be leased to a niece or a nephew; they're all going to be 16 family members there. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's why we were 18 wondering. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think the owner's 20 going to live in one, niece live in one, and one's going to 21 be a storage unit. 22 MR. BARRON: And there's -- she actually 23 lives in another one. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, there's another 25 one? 26 1 MR. BARRON: There's actually four of them 2 there. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, if she leases two of 5 them, it qualifies. You have to meet the standards. 6 MR. BARRON: Okay. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't care who she leases 8 them to, if she leases them to her dog. 9 MR. JOHNSTON: The fact that it's a family 10 member in this case doesn't really make any difference. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Family member doesn't enter 12 into it. No exception. The issue is whether they're 13 leased, whether she collects rent. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How would the Court 15 or U.G.R.A. know that after the fact? 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I mean, if -- we're 17 going to rely on the honesty of the citizens, unless it 18 becomes blatantly obvious. If there's 16 mobile homes out 19 there, and they're all being -- 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sixteen might be a 21 clue. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- and they're all being 23 occupied by family members, you know, that's either a big 24 family or somebody's not telling us the truth. But, if 25 someone tells us they're not leased, they're simply being 27 1 given to a family member, I don't think we look beyond that 2 unless the circumstances tell us that there's some question 3 about that. 4 MR. BARRON: Should we get something to -- 5 sign something to that effect? 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think, from your point of 7 view, that would be a good thing to do. Again, it's -- the 8 family member has nothing to do with it. The question is, 9 are they leased? Are they held out for rent? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wait just a second. 11 Get them to sign what? 12 MR. BARRON: Sign something that says that 13 they're not collecting rent for that piece of property. Or 14 shall we just let it go at their -- their word that they're 15 not collecting rent? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I -- 17 MR. BARRON: I'm just thinking, just send us 18 a letter saying that, you know, it's going to be for a 19 family member. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does U.G.R.A. have 21 that authority to ask that question? 22 MR. BARRON: That's what we're coming to 23 y'all to find out, if we -- how deep do we need to go in 24 this? Do we just take their word for it that they're all 25 going to be family members? Or -- 28 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would think that we 2 would ask them to send us a letter. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd rather us not have a 5 form; I'd rather say if it's not -- if you're not going to 6 rent these, send us a letter to that effect and we'll put it 7 in the file, and that's it. I mean, I think that's -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's not the 9 feelings of Precinct 1. I think we just need to take their 10 word for it. If you catch them, throw the book at them, but 11 requiring something in writing, it's not my opinion. But, 12 I'm outnumbered, so you might as well go ahead and do it. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think I like 14 Commissioner Letz' idea. You might -- you might advise them 15 what the regulations are with respect to rental communities 16 and indicate them to certify that theirs does not meet that 17 standard. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: How about turning it 19 around? Just an idea. Instead of requiring that they 20 certify that, we -- our Designated Representative advises 21 them that those properties -- that they cannot get into the 22 mobile home rental business under the approval, and that we 23 make that letter a part of the pie, so that we've told them 24 that that's the case. Not that it's the other way around. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine. 29 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That we -- there's no 2 question, if they get into the mobile home rental 3 business -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They're doing it 5 knowing -- 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- they're doing it 7 after we told them that that's not permitted. And, if we 8 catch them at it, we throw the book -- 9 MR. JOHNSTON: If they do so, utilities 10 aren't supposed to be hooked up. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's not that long of a 13 document, ten pages. We can just give them -- it's not 14 going to come up that often. You just give them a copy of 15 the rules and say, "Here's the rules." 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And make that a part 17 of our report, that we've so notified them. 18 MR. BARRON: Yeah. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think that would -- 20 that removes the onus that Commissioner Baldwin's talking 21 about of putting it on the landowner to certify. It's just 22 that we're certifying we've told them what the rule is. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Thank you, Stuart. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Stuart, for 25 bringing that to us. It's good to see somebody from 30 1 U.G.R.A. over here. 2 MR. BARRON: Okay. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's move on to Item Number 4 4, consider for approval the final revision of plat for Lots 5 231 to 239 of Northwest Hills, Phase II, Precinct 1. 6 Commissioner Baldwin. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The Kerr County 8 Engineer, Franklin Johnston, I think, will make this 9 presentation. 10 MR. JOHNSTON: This is a replat of several 11 lots, and it's combining two lots to make one big lot with 12 an acreage of 1 1/2 -- 1.4 to 2 acres. While it sounds 13 small, they exist now as less than 1 acre, so they're making 14 them larger by combining lots. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We always like to see 16 them getting bigger. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Going in the right 18 direction. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move that we approve 20 the final revision of plat for Lots 231 through 239 of 21 Northwest Hills, Phase II. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Third. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 25 Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 31 1 approve -- 2 (Commissioner Griffin's cell phone rang.) 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- the final revision of plat 4 for Lots 231 to 239 of Northwest Hills, Phase II, in 5 Precinct 1. Any further questions or comments? If not, all 6 in favor, raise your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did Larry vote? 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Griffin was 13 recorded as voting aye. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Aye. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Judge, if I may just 17 interrupt for a second, that was a phone call -- many of the 18 people here know -- got to know, in the short time we had 19 him with us, Dave Walker, former astronaut. He was a 911 20 Board member for a short period of time. Just died of liver 21 cancer. He was at M.D. Anderson, went in last week, and 22 it's a sad day for the space program. But, that was what 23 that call is. I'm sorry I didn't put that on vibrate. I 24 would not have gotten that. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, we regret to hear that 32 1 Dave has passed on, and we lend our sympathy to his family, 2 as well. Next item for consideration is consider and 3 discuss authorization for hand check for reimbursement of 4 $634.06 payable to Kerr County Republican Party for 5 overpayment of election services, deposited into the Kerr 6 County General Fund. County Clerk, Jannett Pieper. 7 MS. PIEPER: Gentlemen, this is kind of an 8 unusual situation that I was not aware of, but whenever I do 9 services with the -- either the Republican or Democratic 10 Parties, it's my understanding that we -- the County gets 10 11 percent of the budget or something like that. Anyway, 12 Ms. Davis, once the election was over, brought me in a check 13 for 700-something dollars, and I said, "What's this for?" 14 And she said, "It's your part of the election services." 15 So, I had that deposited with Barbara Nemec in the General 16 Fund. And then she came back a little -- couple of weeks 17 later and handed me another check for 400-something dollars, 18 and I said, "What's this for?" And she said, "Well, the 19 State says I owe you more money." And I said, "Okay," so I 20 deposited that with Ms. Nemec also. Well, now the State has 21 informed Ms. Davis that they did another audit and now they 22 have concluded that she overpaid, and they are requesting 23 the $634.06 back, so I would like an authorization for a 24 hand check to be cut out of the General Fund, where it was 25 deposited, back to the Republican Party, and then Ms. Davis 33 1 will forward that money with whatever she's supposed to 2 forward from their party to the State. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jannett, I searched 4 through my packet here over the weekend and went through it 5 forward and backward, and I couldn't find any backup. Is -- 6 you do have a letter from Mrs. Davis or someone that -- 7 MS. PIEPER: I have a letter from the 8 Secretary of State's office to Mrs. Davis that, to me, 9 doesn't make that much sense. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I can understand 11 that; it's from the State. I assume that we would have some 12 kind of documentation that says that you and I need to give 13 up $634. 14 MS. PIEPER: Well, the total on that letter 15 that was to Ms. Davis was a thousand and something dollars. 16 So, I called the Secretary of State's office and said, 17 "Well, what about our 600-and-something that Ms. Davis has 18 said...," and she said, "Oh, well, that -- you have to give 19 that to her, and then she forwards it." Because I thought 20 we would just forward it on to the State. It is -- it's 21 confusing. And -- 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We got roughly $1,000 23 and they're wanting $600 of it back, right? 24 MS. PIEPER: Right, and the remainder of the 25 $1,000, less our $634.06, comes from the Republican Party. 34 1 Because she was supposedly overpaid for her administrative 2 duties, as well. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: The Party giveth and 4 the Party taketh away. And they don't get the interest on 5 it that we drew on it for a few days or whatever. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I guess as 7 long -- I go back to what Commissioner Baldwin said. I 8 think we need to have some documentation in your files. If 9 you're comfortable with what you have, that's sufficient, in 10 my mind, but I think we need to make sure we have some kind 11 of documentation as to -- when we get audited, as to why 12 we're sending -- you know, money coming in and money going 13 out to the Republican Party. 14 MS. PIEPER: Well, I have the letter from the 15 State in my file. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But, does that amount 17 match the dollar amount that we're sending back? I mean -- 18 MS. PIEPER: No, because in that letter, that 19 states 1,000-and-something. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Could we get a new letter 21 from the Secretary of State explaining -- I mean, something 22 with $634.06 on it? 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We need a bill for 24 $634.06. 25 MS. PIEPER: Okay. I will call them -- the 35 1 lady that did the audit, and advise them of such. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Would the Court agree to go 3 ahead and approve the -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- bill, contingent upon 6 obtaining an invoice for the proper amount, either from the 7 Secretary of State or from the Kerr County Republican Party? 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 11 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 12 approve a hand check for reimbursement of $634.06 payable to 13 Kerr County Republican Party for overpayment of election 14 services, contingent upon receipt by the Clerk of an 15 invoice, either from the Texas Secretary of State or the 16 Kerr County Republican Party in that amount. 17 MS. PIEPER: Thank you. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 19 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Since Mr. Tomlinson has 24 solved all the computer problems, let's go back and pay some 25 bills. Does anyone have any questions or comments regarding 36 1 the bills? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Page 5. What did you 3 say, Tommy? 4 MR. TOMLINSON: I said it was not a good 5 night. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah. My house, 7 either. Page 5, County Jail. And I am so thankful our 8 Sheriff is here. 9 MR. TOMLINSON: Me too. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He has a gun on today, 11 too, I might add. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's right, 13 Mr. Baldwin. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Which is kind of rare. 15 I guess the Sheriff -- I would ask him to explain to us the 16 very large amount of prisoner medical expenses. This is 17 many times more than we normally pay per month. Can you 18 give us a -- or give me an explanation? 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Prisoner medical 20 expenses out there have been going up, I'd say skyrocketing 21 a lot over the last year, and part of that is due to -- I 22 even had asked the County Attorney's office to do a little 23 research on an Attorney General's opinion, and Judge Henneke 24 and I spoke about it. And, what it ends up amounting to 25 is -- I think the hospitals and everybody have also figured 37 1 all this out -- is that the County -- due to the fact we do 2 not have a hospital district, the County is liable for 3 all -- all expenses incurred while housing an inmate, 4 whether it is an illness that he had when he came in and we 5 have to have it treated, whether it's an injury he got 6 during an arrest or any other time, we have to pay those 7 bills, totally. And this month alone, it goes back several 8 months on these bills, but the amount you're being asked to 9 pay for is about $8,500 in this -- this Commissioners Court. 10 I don't know of any way around this. We have 11 started billing the counties that we house their inmates 12 for. We have to pay that bill up front, and then we, in 13 turn, send a bill to that county, or a copy of that bill so 14 that they can reimburse Kerr County for it. But, anybody 15 being housed out there, we have to pay total bills on. The 16 only other thing we can do, and we're looking at doing 17 this -- two other things, is there is a legislative deal 18 that came out last year saying that we can start charging 19 inmates $25 a day for housing them. That's if the Judge, 20 during court, orders it, and if the inmate's not indigent, 21 and then you've got to figure out all the indigency stuff. 22 But I'm all for charging those that we can for their stay. 23 And then the only other silver lining that we 24 have done is a lot of the over -- over-the-counter 25 medications, I took them off of Kerr County just furnishing 38 1 those, put them in on the commissary account, like your 2 aspirin and things like that, to where the inmates actually 3 pay for that stuff up front. And we're trying to collect a 4 lot of the prescription fees back out of their commissary 5 account, but it's just a -- it's something that I really 6 hate seeing. I don't agree with it. But, you know, I just 7 don't -- I flat don't agree, and the Judge knows this, that 8 we should have to pay for everything as far as medical. 9 They come in with a toothache, we got to pay it, even though 10 they had it before they got there. I totally disagree. 11 But, the other thing the County Attorney and 12 I have talked about, the only way we can get this money back 13 is actually through billing the inmate once they get out, 14 and then if they don't pay it, filing a lawsuit against the 15 inmate to collect those fees. And even though we may not 16 collect too much and it could be a long, drawn-out deal, I 17 feel that we need to start filing those lawsuits to at least 18 attempt to get some of the taxpayers' money back. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sheriff, is any of 20 this reimbursable on today's list? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There may have been a 22 couple from Llano on there that should be. 23 MR. TOMLINSON: I notice that some of these 24 are -- are old bills. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: All the way back to 39 1 June of last year. That's -- 2 MR. TOMLINSON: So that kind of -- that kind 3 of distorts the number. You know, two of them are from 4 November from City of Kerrville, and then there's one, as 5 the Commissioner pointed out, back to June of 2000. One 6 back to January. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think what happens a 8 lot of times, they may go ahead -- 'cause I have where our 9 jailers, anybody that takes an inmate to the hospital, we do 10 not sign any of that paperwork saying that we're liable or 11 anything else, and the hospitals and doctors may be actually 12 trying to bill the inmate first, and when they don't get it 13 from them, they come back to the County. And, if the guy 14 was in custody at the time, we don't have much of a choice. 15 So, a lot of those bills are coming in late, and it kind of 16 looks like some hospital bills and doctors have gone back on 17 their records on things that they hadn't gotten, where they 18 knew the guy was an inmate, and they're doing it. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rusty, on the EMS 20 charges, are those transports? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: From the jail to the 23 hospital? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yep, $273. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's two of them in 40 1 one day for the same guy. Was he just out riding around or 2 what? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What that one was, if I 4 recall right on that, the inmate came in highly, highly 5 intoxicated, past the point that it could be dangerous to 6 himself, started throwing up blood and that, had to be 7 transported to the emergency room. They treated him at the 8 emergency room, they came back to the jail, because he had 9 not been released, and then he had a seizure and had to be 10 transported back to the hospital again. We get both bills. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's interesting 12 about that one is the bill is five months coming from EMS. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: A lot of those, I have 14 tried to wait for the -- the County Attorney's opinion on 15 whether we have to actually pay them, because I totally 16 disagree with it. And, we finally -- after the County 17 Attorney reviewed it and with the A.G.'s opinions, I don't 18 have a choice. 19 MR. TOMLINSON: Just for your information, 20 the person out at the jail that operates the commissary is 21 excellent. She does a very good job, and she -- she gets 22 every dime out of their commissary account that she can. 23 And, when I see those records, I know that -- that they do a 24 good job. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions or 41 1 comments about the bills as presented? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we pay them. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 5 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve 6 payment of the bills as presented and recommended by the 7 Auditor. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 8 favor, raise your right hand. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Budget 13 Amendment Request Number 1 is from the District Clerk. 14 MR. TOMLINSON: This is from the District 15 Clerk. Her request is to transfer $390 from Part-Time 16 Salaries to Evidence Storage Rent. I have a statement from 17 the vault storage place here in Kerrville for that purpose. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is she getting more 19 storage space, or did they go up that much? I guess we're 20 talking -- 21 MR. TOMLINSON: No, I think it's something 22 new, because it's for the months of April through June. 23 That's all the bill says, so I -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that the one over 25 on Water Street? 42 1 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The amount's interesting, 4 because it's the same as the total budget was. That's the 5 reason the current budget was $390. The current expense is 6 $390. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She must be just 8 getting another space or another slot or another room, just 9 like the one she's been renting, I guess. So moved. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 12 Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 13 approve Budget Amendment Request Number 1 from the District 14 Clerk. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 15 favor, raise your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Amendment 20 Request Number 2 is from the District Courts. 21 MR. TOMLINSON: This transfers $2,807.09 from 22 Special Trials out of the 198th Court to the 216th Court. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 43 1 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve 2 Budget Amendment Request Number 2 for the District Courts. 3 Any further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, 4 raise your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Number 3 9 relates to the 198th District Court. 10 MR. TOMLINSON: This request is to transfer 11 $100 from -- out of the jury fund, from Jurors to Court 12 Interpreter for $100. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a typo? Is 16 that -- should that be 436 instead of 426 on that Jurors 17 item? They're both -- 18 MR. TOMLINSON: I'm not sure, I don't have my 19 chart of accounts with me. I think that the -- the top 20 one's actually wrong. I think the 436 is a typo for sure. 21 They're the same fund, so I -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The 436 -- based on the 23 Number 2, 436 is the 198th. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: I'd have to look. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can check. 44 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 2 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve 3 Budget Amendment Request Number 3 for the 198th District 4 Court. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 5 favor, raise your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Request 10 Number 4 is from the Constable of Precinct 2. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: This is his request to 12 transfer $50 from Equipment Repair to Miscellaneous, and 13 it's for a psychological examination by Hardy Davis -- W. 14 Hardy Davis. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 18 Williams, seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 19 approve Budget Amendment Request Number 4 for Constable, 20 Precinct 2. Any further questions or comments? If not, all 21 in favor -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question. It's for a 23 psychological evaluation on who? 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's required for his 25 license. 45 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, for his -- oh. By 2 him for his license, okay. 3 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah, it's for his license. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 5 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Do we have 10 any late bills? 11 MR. TOMLINSON: I have two. One is to the 12 Texas Center for the Judiciary for $70. It's for 13 registration fee for Judge Prohl. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 17 seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court authorize a 18 hand check in the amount of $70 payable to the Texas Center 19 for the Judiciary. Any further questions or comments? If 20 not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 25 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. The next -- the last 46 1 one is for J.P. 1 for $204 to the Kerrville Postmaster for 2 six -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To who? 4 MR. TOMLINSON: Kerrville Postmaster for six 5 rolls of stamps. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 9 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve a 10 hand check in the amount of $204 payable to the Postmaster 11 for the J.P., Precinct 1. Any further questions or 12 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Let's go 17 ahead and do Item Number 7 before we have our public 18 hearing. Consider and discuss authorization to purchase 19 scanning equipment to replace the existing files in Voter 20 Registration Department of Tax Office. Ms. Bolin. 21 MS. BOLIN: Paula's having back surgery 22 today, so I'm going to see if I can wing this. Last year in 23 our budget, we requested a file cabinet with Capital Outlay, 24 and we were approved. When we got ready to purchase it, we 25 decided we did not have a place to put the file cabinet, so 47 1 Paula and I started looking into alternatives for filing for 2 voter registration. We looked at an electronic filing 3 cabinet that would be floor-to-ceiling. It's 5 feet wide; 4 there would be no space saving. It would actually take up 5 more space, and last about 10 years, at $24,000. So, we 6 checked with the State on scanning or imaging. They said 7 that we would not have to keep hard copies any longer. At 8 this point, we have to keep them indefinitely. If they've 9 been canceled, we have to keep them for two years. 10 The -- in your agenda request, there is an 11 estimate on the cost of it. Part of the funding will come 12 from the Secretary of State's office, which is our Chapter 13 19 Fund that is strictly for voter registration. The amount 14 that we've allotted down here is all that we have in Chapter 15 19. The money from the County would come from the Records 16 Preservation Fund, which is the fund that Linda Uecker 17 collects for records management, and there's $38,000 in that 18 fund. I've checked with Tommy. We checked with Linda and 19 we checked with Jannett, because she also collects, but hers 20 is earmarked for her office. 21 The reason we're coming out of budget time is 22 because I deal with all of the elections within the county, 23 not just county elections. Like, Jannett deals strictly 24 with state and county; I deal with schools, city, the whole 25 thing. Our off-time is going to be this summer. What we 48 1 would like to do, we have got blocks established that need 2 to be filed and no place to put the files. The -- in 3 October, we'll be in tax season. November, I do mass 4 mailout, and then we go into the primary season. We will 5 not have time to do anything next year at all, so we're 6 requesting the $17,868 out of the Funds Preservation -- the 7 Records Management Preservation Fund so that we can go ahead 8 and get started and try to get this under way, try to get 9 done during our slow time. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Question. 11 MS. BOLIN: Yes, sir. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where does -- where 13 does this fund come from, this Records Management 14 Preservation Fund? How is that thing put together and 15 maintained and filled up and -- 16 MS. BOLIN: Good question. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is it fines in the 18 courts? 19 MR. TOMLINSON: It's a straight fee for 20 records preservation, yes. It's allowed by the Legislature. 21 I think that the County Clerk and the District Clerk both 22 collect that fee. It's -- the legislation specifically says 23 that it's for that purpose, for records preservation. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If someone comes 25 through the court system with a D.W.I., the Judge can assess 49 1 this fee? 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's automatically assessed, 3 added on to any suit that's filed. That's not a criminal 4 add-on, it's a civil add-on. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My point is that it's 6 not coming out of the taxpayers' pocket, though. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: No. 8 MS. PIEPER: Buster, may I address that? Any 9 document that is filed in my office is $9. $5 of that is 10 Records Management. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Great. 12 MS. PIEPER: And that is set out by the 13 State; that's not set out by Commissioners Court or myself 14 or the District Clerk's office. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Great. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Of the $9, you retain 17 $5; is that correct? 18 MS. PIEPER: Well, $5 of that is placed into 19 the Records Management line item. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Okay. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I visited with Paula last 22 week on this, and Diane. I mean, to me, this makes sense. 23 It's a way to solve a problem they've been having for a long 24 time of this volumes of paper, and a way to kind of, I 25 guess, make this whole area more efficient and be able to 50 1 keep track of the records, and -- because they -- they keep 2 track, as I understand it, of these voting cards. Once 3 you're registered to vote here, you know, until you die, if 4 you're a resident of the county, they keep track of all your 5 moves and all your changes, and it's been very cumbersome. 6 I think, you know, it's a big expense right now. And, I 7 don't approve of things out of budget, but this is something 8 that I think is a good idea and going to help us down the 9 road. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Absolutely. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That was a motion, 13 wasn't it? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Moved by Commissioner 17 Letz, seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court amend 18 the Capital Outlay budget for the line item for the -- 19 Tommy? 20 MR. TOMLINSON: Since you are going into 21 surplus, you have to have a budget amendment. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Budget emergency, you mean? 23 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Budget emergency? 25 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 51 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. All right, I'll work 2 that in. Moved by Commissioner Letz, seconded by 3 Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court declare a budget 4 emergency, authorize amendment of the Capital Outlay list 5 for the Tax Assessor/Collector's office to include the 6 equipment for the imaging capture station in the Voter 7 Registration section, and also authorize use of $17,868 from 8 the Records Management Fund for purposes of purchasing that 9 equipment, together with funds from the State and the funds 10 allotted in the 2000/2001 Capital Outlay budget. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, my only question, 12 since I'm the one that made the motion, just to clarify my 13 motion, is this -- can we declare -- does this meet the 14 criteria for an emergency? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, if it was out of 16 the General Fund, I would say no. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Capital improvements. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Out of -- 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: This is out of a dedicated 20 fund. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Dedicated fund for 22 this purpose. And I think it does, because of the 23 requirement to meet the next voting cycle. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: And also via the fact that 52 1 we'll be redistricting, so there should be another huge 2 demand on the Tax Assessor's Voter Registration section. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's sufficient for me. 4 I'm just glad that discussion is on the record. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Unless I get a dissent from 6 Mr. Lucas. 7 MR. LUCAS: No, I think you're right, Judge. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Does everyone understand 9 where we're going here? Any further questions or comments? 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Just one quick 11 question, and that is, is this scanning equipment, as we're 12 -- we would be buying it, would it be available for other 13 purposes other than just voting records? 14 MS. BOLIN: Yes, it would. If we decided to 15 go to scanning in the Tax Department, these could also be 16 used for that. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think that's a very 18 important point, too. Seals my vote. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 20 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 25 MS. BOLIN: Can I get you to sign my purchase 53 1 agreement? They were scheduled to -- all the way through 2 the middle of June, so we tried to get it pushed up so we 3 could go ahead and get started. They went ahead and faxed 4 this, or sent it to me last week. 5 (Discussion off the record.) 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. It is now 10 o'clock. 7 We are scheduled for a public hearing on -- get a look at my 8 agenda here -- public hearing on revision of plat for Tract 9 16 of Silver Hills Subdivision, Precinct Number 2. 10 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 10:00 a.m., and a public hearing 11 was held in open court, as follows:) 12 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: This is a public hearing. 14 Anyone who wishes to comment may do so. We ask that you 15 fill out a participation form, presented at the time. 16 Depending on how many people wish to speak, we will limit 17 your comments to no more than three minutes per speaker. We 18 would ask that you keep your comments relevant to the issue 19 of the revision of plat for Tract 16. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: May I speak? 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yes. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think it would be 23 appropriate at this time to set this up, Judge, before we 24 get into public comment on this. This public hearing is an 25 outgrowth of a -- 54 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Commissioner, I think 2 we need to recess our -- we didn't recess our normal 3 session. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: All right. We will formally 5 recess the Commissioners Court meeting and open a public 6 hearing on the revision of plat for Tract 16 of Silver Hills 7 Subdivision, and we'll ask if any of the Commissioners have 8 any comments they'd like to make before we take testimony 9 from the public. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. 11 Now that we're in the public hearing, this is an outgrowth 12 of a -- of a developer's request for subdivision approval of 13 a development, I believe, known as Paso Creek. It sits in 14 an area adjacent to Silver Hills Subdivision, and the 15 developer originally was -- there was an indicated need that 16 he should find another ingress and egress to his 17 subdivision. And, as a result of that, he went searching 18 for some property, and apparently has come up with Tract 16 19 into Silver Hills Subdivision. I think it's appropriate for 20 the Court to note that I have given you a copy of a petition 21 which was delivered to me by Mr. Larry George of Silver 22 Hills, and he handed me a couple more names this morning to 23 add to this particular list of folks who are not too happy 24 over the fact that their subdivision is going to be intruded 25 upon by a road connecting to another subdivision. That's 55 1 all I'm going to say about it right now. Just set the stage 2 up for you. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other comments before we 4 entertain comments from the public? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question. Do we have a 6 plat available? 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: I asked Franklin to bring one 8 in. Franklin, did you bring a plat? 9 MS. KNEESE: I have one. 10 MR. JOHNSTON: I think Charles has a drawing 11 here that's more instructive than the plat. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Here's one we can 13 share, also. Is that a new one? Same one? 14 MR. DOMINGUES: Well, this is a plat of the 15 original Silver Hills Subdivision, okay? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Here's 16-B. That is 17 proposed to be split for a road. 18 MR. DOMINGUES: Here's kind of a diagram of 19 it, shows where 16-B is here. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. The first person who 21 has signed up to address the Court is Ms. Julie Snyder. 22 Ms. Snyder? 23 MS. SNYDER: Morning. I'm Julie Snyder. I 24 live at 500 Silver Hills Road, been there since December of 25 1986. I bought this property mainly because it's on a 56 1 cul-de-sac, it was quiet and peaceful. And that peace has 2 been intruded upon by, first of all, the person who 3 purchased that lot a few years back, and it has just become 4 a junk pile of old mobile homes and trucks right down my 5 fence line. I'm on Lot Number 15. The proposed road 6 travels the entire 1,100 point -- 1,107.1 feet of my fence 7 line. I am greatly opposed to that. I received this news 8 one week -- in the same week that I decided that I'm going 9 to take a night job and sleep days. This proposed road is 10 going to be about 220 feet from my bedroom. It's also going 11 to increase traffic along the road, and there are a lot of 12 children and people who walk that road for exercise, and I'm 13 terribly opposed to more traffic and more trash and the 14 noise. 15 The only bright spot I could possibly see in 16 any of this is, if this road is approved, that the either 17 the developer or the owner of the tract receiving funds for 18 the road access build an 8-foot privacy fence so that I 19 don't have to see it and I don't have to hear all of the 20 noise that's there. I'm absolutely opposed to changing the 21 plat to include a road that will become a very main 22 thoroughfare to Center Point. At this point, we have to 23 leave our road, go down to Highway 173, either going to Camp 24 Verde or Upper Turtle Creek to go to Center Point, and I 25 know that if that road is right at my driveway, I'll 57 1 probably take it to go to Center Point 3 miles down the 2 road, rather than taking a 10-mile trek. And I know that 3 when the public finds out there's a shorter route, the 4 traffic's going to increase by leaps and bounds. I'm 5 opposed to the road. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Marie Ellis or 7 James Blalock? 8 MR. RAMSPERGER: Yes, sir. I'm at 555 -- 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: I called for Marie Ellis or 10 James Blalock. 11 MR. RAMSPERBER: I'm sorry, sir. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Marie Ellis or James Blalock? 13 MR. RAMSPERGER: No. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Are they here? 15 AUDIENCE: She had to leave for other 16 purposes. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. All right. 18 MR. RAMSPERGER: My property's at 555 Silver 19 Hills. I'm directly across from -- 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Identify yourself, please. 21 MR. RAMSPERGER: My name is John Ramsperger, 22 sir. I'm directly across from Lot 16 on Lot 7, so the road 23 will come into my property or front my property. Like the 24 lady that just addressed you, I find that this will be -- I 25 think it will open up a thoroughfare to Center Point from our 58 1 area, and it will also possibly increase thievery in our 2 area, because there will be a second way out. And, I would 3 ask you gentlemen to consider that up front, that we are 4 people out there who live in large area tracts and single 5 homes. Most of us aren't home during the day, and places can 6 be -- theft can take place, and they would have another way 7 out of the subdivision rather than going back out the one in 8 and one out, which would add to our chances of being put-upon 9 by thieves at that point. So, I am -- I am opposed to the 10 road. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, sir. Stephanie 12 George? 13 MS. GEORGE: I'm Stephanie George. I live at 14 401 Silver Hills Road. I absolutely concur with the two 15 folks who have already addressed you. I would just like to 16 add some thoughts about my concern for the value of our 17 property. The reason we chose Silver Hills Road for our 18 permanent retirement residence was because it was on a 19 dead-end street, and we wanted to be out in the country. I 20 feel certain that that road will become a thoroughfare, 21 should it open up onto River Road through that subdivision. 22 In addition to that, Silver Hills Road is a very small, rural 23 road. It's already coming apart at the pavement on the -- on 24 the edge of the road just from the increased traffic that 25 we've received already. In addition to that, there are other 59 1 pieces of property back behind the tract in question that 2 will probably be developed as well, so that would add that 3 traffic potentially to our road. And, on a personal note, we 4 have grandchildren who really enjoy coming out to the country 5 from Kerrville and playing on the property, and up until now 6 we've really not been too concerned, but the traffic is 7 already increasing on that road. And we're strongly opposed 8 to having that road put through to -- as a thoroughfare. 9 Thank you, gentlemen. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Larry George? 11 MR. GEORGE: Just a couple of things I'd like 12 to add. I'm Larry George, 401 Silver Hills Road. Silver 13 Hills Road, when I checked the plat, is only a 50-foot 14 easement. It's not even a standard 60-foot county road 15 easement. That road is very narrow. There's a bar ditch on 16 each side. Twice in the last three years I've had someone go 17 down the bank and through my -- and through my fence, you 18 know, because the road is narrow and curved -- lots of curves 19 on it. That petition that I submitted, those last two names 20 I gave you this morning, that is every resident property 21 owner in Silver Hills, with one exception, is an older lady 22 that's ill and probably wouldn't understand what that 23 petition was all about and what was going on here. Other 24 than Mrs. Stanley, that's every resident property owner in 25 Silver Hills signed that petition. And, I think everything 60 1 else has been pretty much covered. We already have a lot of 2 traffic on that road, because there's a trailer park -- I 3 don't want to use the word "bootleg," but there's a trailer 4 park back in there that has grown and grown over the years, 5 which has increased the traffic over the years. And, the 6 road -- the road just can't handle any more traffic. Thank 7 you. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, sir. Anyone else 9 who'd like to address the Court during this public hearing 10 on this issue? 11 MS. JOHNSON: I'm Jill Johnson. I live at 12 600 Silver Hills Road. I'm at the dead-end. And, again, 13 that's one reason why I bought the property in '75. I 14 didn't move up here permanently until '97, but I'm at the 15 end, and I've enjoyed that. We worked with a fellow several 16 years ago to pave the road. We all kind of put money on it 17 and then it turned out that the County helped pay for it. 18 But, again, it's very narrow, just room enough for two cars. 19 There is an addition going in down on 173 where they already 20 have two entrances more on our road. The property that we 21 have talked about is -- has a lot of old mobile homes; it's 22 pretty junky. It has thistles that are taller than I am 23 growing all over it; it's not well-kept. We have complained 24 about that, but nothing has really been done about it. I 25 agree also that we have one way in and one way out; that if 61 1 we have the extra road, it will be more traffic, and as 2 Julie said, we -- if thefts are something that do occur, 3 they do have another way out. That was one reason we're all 4 living there, because of the one way in. We've had some 5 problems with people coming down at the end, especially -- 6 I'm at the end. They've run into my gate a couple times. 7 They had a D.P.S. chase a driver from the saloon down the 8 road, and he didn't know it was a dead-end, and he -- it was 9 a dead-end when he finally got there. But, other than that, 10 we haven't had too much problem. I'm afraid that with more 11 traffic, we would have. Thank you very much. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Ms. Johnson. 13 Anyone else? Anyone else like to address the Court during 14 the public hearing? 15 MS. ELKINS: Hi. I'm on the petition. I'm 16 Patricia Elkins, and we live at 290 Silver Hills Road. 17 There's just one thing that they failed to mention, the other 18 speakers. When you first come on Silver Hills Road -- and I 19 don't know if you're familiar with it -- there's, like, a 20 hairpin curve that you have to come up. Coming off of that, 21 cars have actually gone off that end. If you get too much 22 traffic, I think it's evident that there would be some real 23 problems there. I don't know that it could be changed. I 24 doubt it. It would be too severe of a -- a drop onto 173, 25 but right now it's dangerous all by itself, especially when 62 1 there's ice. Thank you. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Anyone else? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I would like 4 Charles to come up and put all this together so I can see 5 it. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I figured it out. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You've got it figured 8 out, Jon? 9 (Discussion off the record.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mr. Domingues, you have 11 something to add? 12 MR. DOMINGUES: Judge, would you want me to 13 address the Court in the public hearing? 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's entirely up to you. 15 MR. DOMINGUES: This map is a map of the 16 general area in question. The red outline is the 17 subdivision that is going in, Paso Creek. And, I think one 18 of the big concerns is the additional traffic, and that's 19 what I would like to address, more so than anything else. 20 First of all, this is only designed as a high water for this 21 subdivision, really, okay? There wouldn't be any additional 22 traffic, possibly, from the subdivision going out, because 23 as you can see from the front of the subdivision to Highway 24 173, it's 1.4 miles. Okay? From the back of the 25 subdivision to Highway 173, it's 2.4 miles. If they were to 63 1 go through Silver Hills, it's almost 4 miles around, so the 2 likelihood of them going away from Kerrville and then 3 turning -- traffic, and then turning towards Kerrville is 4 very unlikely to do so. 5 The whole thing -- the whole idea of this, of 6 course, is we've -- when we first brought this to you was 7 for a high water exit. If the Court wishes, the developer 8 said that he would make it as a private, gated road and a 9 private road, unpaved, where nobody would use it except in 10 emergencies. And, emergency vehicles -- if you were to have 11 a fire out there, the fire truck come in here and try to get 12 over to Silver Hills, it would have to go all the way 13 around, where if there is an access to there, you know, even 14 if it's a private access, fire trucks and emergency vehicles 15 can get through, if the Court wishes that. The developer 16 has no problem in making it private -- private, gated road. 17 But, the whole idea and the whole concept of it is not to 18 use it, as -- you know, for the traffic of the subdivision, 19 but as a high water -- when the creek is high and the 20 property owners wish to get out of their property. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anything else? 22 MS. SNYDER: I have a question. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yes, Ms. Snyder? 24 MS. SNYDER: I'm Julie Snyder again. The 25 division of the lot is 120 feet from my fence line, and I 64 1 understand from the surveyor that the road would be 120 feet 2 from my fence line. Has the developer purchased just that 3 roadway, or that Lot 16A as well? The thin, narrow strip 4 between my fence line and the road? I'd be interested to 5 know that, because I'm really concerned that if that road 6 goes in, there's 120 feet, there's enough room to park 7 mobile homes right down my fence line, and it looks like 8 that's what the owner of that property is planning to do. 9 There are about seven or eight mobile homes parked there, 10 just sitting. Some really trashy looking ones, but vacant. 11 There are more than one -- I think there's more than one 12 home occupied at the time. I'm not sure who all lives 13 there, but there's a lot of traffic in and out of that end 14 of the road where that mobile home setting is, and I would 15 be interested to know if the developer has purchased that 16 small strip between Lot 15 and 16. 17 MR. WORSHAM: I'll comment on that if you'd 18 like for me to. I am the developer, or one of them. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Give your name for the 20 record. 21 MR. WORSHAM: I'm Bob Worsham, and we 22 purchased actually the road surface only, not the lot 23 between the road and your property. Y'all have all 24 commented on the amount of mobile homes parked on there. 25 You may like to know that I am working with the owner of 65 1 that property, trying to get him to remove those and utilize 2 those for a residential tract instead of having them look 3 like that. 4 MS. SNYDER: What about the junkpile of 5 trucks that are -- 6 MR. WORSHAM: This is what I said. I'm 7 trying to get him to remove all of that and utilize the 8 property for a residential setting instead of for parking 9 all of this. 10 MS. SNYDER: Would you be opposed to a 11 privacy fence along that property line? 12 MR. WORSHAM: If you'd like to build a 13 privacy fence, that's fine with me. 14 MS. SNYDER: No, sir, I'm not creating the 15 problem. 16 MR. WORSHAM: I mean, I'm answering your 17 question. All we did was try to have an emergency access 18 out of Paso Creek Subdivision, and in the event of high 19 water, people could get in and out. In other words, we did 20 not want somebody to be stuck in there. In the event 21 they're having a heart attack, they need to go to the 22 hospital. This is the purpose for the purchase of the road 23 and the access through Silver Hills. Thank you. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I have a couple of 25 questions for Mr. Domingues and for Mr. Williams. Refresh 66 1 my memory. Paso Creek Road is a private road or county 2 road? 3 MR. DOMINGUES: It's a county road, sir. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Paso Creek? 5 MR. DOMINGUES: Yes. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Coming in off of C.P. 7 River Road. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It will be a county road 9 through there? 10 MR. DOMINGUES: County road, yes, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And Silver Hills Road is 12 a county road? 13 MR. DOMINGUES: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Going back to the 15 purpose, I mean, the high water -- was that at the -- and my 16 memory tells me the Court wanted that high water route, 17 or -- is that something that we thought of or something that 18 the developer wanted? 19 MR. DOMINGUES: That's something that the 20 developer wanted, yes, 'cause he's making a high class 21 development there of large tracts and very nice homes, and 22 it's a selling point to be able to tell somebody that 23 they've got access to the property, even in high water. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What type of flood 25 frequency will the crossing over Paso Creek handle on Paso 67 1 Creek Road? 2 MR. DOMINGUES: That will not handle very 3 much of a flood, that crossing, no, sir. It's a low water 4 crossing. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess my point is that 6 there's a lot of low water crossings in the county that 7 people occasionally have the inconvenience of being behind 8 and can't get out in high water. But, I mean, if it's a 9 5-year frequency, it's not a very big problem. If it's a 10 last night's rain, it's more of a problem. 11 MR. DOMINGUES: Last night's rain wouldn't 12 cause that. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I guess my final 14 question is, are there any rules -- subdivision rules in 15 Silver Hills regarding use of -- or I guess any 16 restrictions, I guess? 17 MR. DOMINGUES: We have not found any. 18 MR. WORSHAM: There are no restrictions. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Anything else? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have one comment. 21 I think that it should be noted that in the earlier 22 discussion, Commissioner, there was some -- there was some 23 discussion about options with respect to ingress and egress 24 over low water crossings, and one of the suggestions was 25 that that low water crossing could be elevated to eliminate 68 1 that problem, as opposed to going out in the other 2 direction. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 4 MR. DOMINGUES: The problem with that is you 5 can't elevate one very high to -- you know, in draws like 6 that. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All a matter of 8 dollars, Mr. Domingues. 9 MR. DOMINGUES: Yes, sir. And the County's 10 got the same problem with the crossing they have. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I didn't say the 12 County was going to do it. 13 MR. DOMINGUES: Well, I mean, the County's 14 got a problem with the bridge that went out. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Is there anyone else who'd 16 like to address the Court during the public hearing? If 17 not, we'll declare the public hearing closed. 18 (The public hearing was concluded at 10:22 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court 19 meeting was reopened.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: At this time, let's take our 21 mid-morning break and return at 20 minutes until 11:00. 22 (Recess taken from 10:23 a.m. to 10:40 a.m.) 23 - - - - - - - - - - 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's 20 minutes to 11:00 and 25 we'll reconvene this regular special session of the Kerr 69 1 County Commissioners Court. Next item for discussion on the 2 agenda is Item Number 8. Can the County include, in either 3 its Subdivision Rules and Regulations and/or its O.S.S.F. 4 Regulations, a provision requiring O.S.S.F. application and 5 installation on property within a platted subdivision prior 6 to utilities being turned on to said property? Commissioner 7 Williams. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I put this on for 9 discussion. I don't know where this is going to go, but 10 we've got at least two situations in Precinct 2, and each of 11 you may have similar situations in your precincts, where we 12 have, in the most recent case, a platted subdivision, 13 approved by the County. Most of the dwellings in there are 14 double-wides moved in. It has the potential for being a 15 nice community. The problem is that, quite often, at least 16 on two occasions here recently, where utilities end up being 17 turned on before septic applications are made or septics are 18 installed or septics are inspected, and occupants then -- 19 people then occupy the dwelling. And, in order to take care 20 of the wastewater problems, they do one of two or both 21 things: They either put a port-a-potty outside the front 22 door or on the garage side, or -- and/or they will hook up a 23 PVC pipe underneath the superstructure of the double-wide 24 and they'll take that gray water, whatever happens to be in 25 it, and just drain it off on the lot. If, as, and when they 70 1 get around to filing for a septic application -- they go 2 ahead and do that sooner or later -- septic is installed. 3 But, in the meantime, people are occupying the dwelling 4 without approved or inspected sewage-type facilities. 5 The most grievous of all of the situations I 6 have is in Hill River Estates, way over in the eastern part 7 of the precinct, and that's just a one-in, one-out. One's 8 got no septic, he's gone, another one comes in. First thing 9 you know, you got cesspools and all sort of things, and so I 10 asked the County Attorney a couple questions. Is it 11 possible for us to address this particular issue? Seems to 12 me this is the -- a failing in that we -- we cannot seem to 13 get our -- our act together on this O.S.S.F. And what comes 14 first, the chicken or the egg? And, in this particular 15 case, we have people occupying before they have septic, and 16 so is there a possibility, either through Section 5.03 of 17 our Subdivision Rules and Regulations or Section 10, 18 O.S.S.F. -- can we install a regulation requiring that 19 utilities cannot be turned on until there is an approved 20 septic on the property? 21 I asked the County Attorney to do a little 22 research, and we've had a couple conversations about it, and 23 he's not hopeful that there is anything in the Government 24 Code or any other code that enables us to do that. Which 25 prompts me to ask, Travis -- if you'll come up, I'd 71 1 appreciate it. I guess, in the alternative, I'm wondering, 2 can -- if we can't find anyone to give us express authority 3 to do this, do you find any prohibitions in the Health and 4 Safety Code that would disallow our having a rule or 5 regulation in the Subdivision or O.S.S.F. that would require 6 these things to come in an orderly sequence leading up to 7 licensed and inspected, operational septic prior to 8 occupancy? That's the question. 9 MR. LUCAS: No. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do we find any 11 prohibition? 12 MR. LUCAS: Well, again, like the way I 13 explained to you, counties have got to operate out of 14 express authority, or implied authority from some sort of 15 express authority. And, so, using that as a basis and a 16 starting point, still nothing. There's nothing there. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it seems to me -- 18 I mean, you mentioned port-a-potty, and while this may not 19 be the preferred manner, I don't see there's any prohibition 20 against them doing that. 21 MR. LUCAS: There's not. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what he's 23 telling me. You know, and it's clearly understandable that 24 on -- on the construction sites, you see that all the time. 25 That's accepted practice. And, if they're maintaining -- I 72 1 assume they're maintained. If they're not maintained, that 2 opens up another possibility, that they're in violation of 3 the Health Code for failure to maintain them. But, it's 4 just -- it's the sequence of things. It's the sequence that 5 will permit gray water to be dumped out on the ground 6 untreated because there is no septic in place, or 7 port-a-pottys used for extended periods of time due to the 8 failure of the occupancy to file the application or pursue 9 the application, or because perhaps the installers are 10 backed up in their work and can't get around to doing what 11 they're contracted to do, creating an inordinate delay. It 12 becomes a problem for neighbors who have to take a look at 13 it, and that's the nature of the complaints we get. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess -- I guess my way 15 of looking at this is, it's a subdivision homeowners' 16 problem. If they're not going to allow port-a-pottys, they 17 need to address that in the deed restrictions. Because, I 18 mean, I don't see any way you can get around that. You can 19 do that, the way I -- I mean, that's the reason to have 20 port-a-pottys. 21 MR. LUCAS: And composting toilets as well, 22 and in some situations, things like holding tanks, or in the 23 right factual circumstance, gray water released onto the 24 property, if it's from a washing machine, as long as it 25 doesn't pool. 'Cause the rule says doesn't run off the 73 1 property, that type of thing. But -- 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I don't think there's 3 anything -- based on my substantial hours of going through 4 this particular issue, I don't think there's anything that 5 the County is allowed to do, because we are not given that 6 authority for the specific instance you're talking about. 7 However, there is one little piece that's in 366, and let me 8 read it to you, 'cause I think it would be a way, at least, 9 that our Designated Representative -- if it were really 10 followed, it's a way our Designated Representative is going 11 to know that there is a new residence of some type going 12 into a property, because I don't think this happens. And 13 I'm quoting out of -- 14 MR. LUCAS: 366.005. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: 366.005. 16 MR. LUCAS: Utility hookups. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. And it says -- 18 and I'll try to paraphrase this, but it says electric 19 utility shall compile a list weekly -- a weekly list for 20 each county in the state -- in this state of the addresses 21 located in the unincorporated area of the county at which 22 the electric utility has made new service connections during 23 the preceding week. I don't think -- if we get that, it 24 goes into the ether somewhere. We never see it. And I 25 think what really ought to happen is that we ought to make 74 1 sure our utilities do that, and that, as a matter of fact -- 2 MR. LUCAS: Come straight to the Judge, in 3 fact. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- a copy goes -- 5 ought to go to the Judge, and if -- and immediately to the 6 Designated Representative, so we know where new residences 7 or businesses or whatever else is being established, 'cause 8 that may be the only clue we get until some weeks later we 9 get a complaint from a constituent that says, "I've got an 10 eyesore," and a guy's -- somebody's using a port-a-potty or 11 whatever in that -- in that section, which we are allowed to 12 do. 13 MR. LUCAS: In fact, they're commanded to do 14 it. It says "shall." Utilities shall submit. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Utilities have to do 16 that on a weekly basis, not a monthly basis. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Notify of service 18 having been turned on? Or application for service? 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No. No, that the 20 service has made a new electric service connection. What 21 I'm saying is, it's the best deal available. At least we 22 would know where somebody has moved onto a piece of property 23 and established electric service. That information goes 24 through our D.R. The D.R. takes a look at it and sees 25 what's going on. Is there a residence? Is it a 75 1 construction site? And, that's it for now. That's fine. 2 If it looks like somebody's set up housekeeping, then we got 3 to go to the next step, find out what sort of O.S.S.F. 4 facilities are planned, applied for, forgotten, overlooked, 5 ignored, whatever the case may be. But I think it's a tool 6 that we are allowed to use, and it's a directive on the 7 utilities. I'm just not sure it's happening. Do we see 8 that report weekly? 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: No. 10 MS. SOVIL: We don't see it weekly. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: We get them less periodic 12 than weekly. When we do get them, we do make copies of them 13 and send them to U.G.R.A. and KCAD. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Maybe that would 15 help. As a helpful aid, we could -- the Court could request 16 that the Judge write a letter to the utility service 17 companies, or County Attorney write a letter to the utility 18 service companies and cite the section of law that requires 19 them to do this, and urge them to get more compliant. 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And make it timely. 21 It's supposed to be weekly for the preceding week, so that 22 means by close of business this week, you already know what 23 was done the week before. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does it say what 25 information is supplied? 76 1 MR. LUCAS: It just says, essentially, state 2 the addresses located in the unincorporated area of the 3 county at which the electric utility has been made -- has 4 made a new electric service connection. So, just the 5 address. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess my question is -- 7 two, coming in -- or, right now, three. The addressing 8 situation is such we may never know where these are. We 9 don't have 911 addresses right now, so, I mean, they're not 10 going to know where they are in most areas of the county. 11 But, that hopefully will be solved before long. For 12 example, I just redid the electrical route on my house, 13 added three new meters and all that. It would have come out 14 Route 1, Box 71. They wouldn't know where that was. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think the way the 16 utilities have it is they -- they go through the R number 17 for the lot -- I mean for the tract of land. 18 MR. LUCAS: The legal description, almost. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah. It's like they 20 have it either by R number, which is the tax -- taxing 21 authority number, or it's by legal description. It's one of 22 the two; they don't use addresses. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: They don't use billing 25 addresses. Like -- it's, like, physical address. 77 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Either way, I see a -- I 2 mean, addressing, U.G.R.A.'s got to be able to figure out 3 where this spot is by whatever information they're given, 4 and they -- maybe they'll know, maybe they won't. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: They don't -- they 6 have to have a pole number and all that. They know exactly 7 where it is. We could get -- we can translate that data; 8 there's no doubt in my mind, 'cause they have to physically 9 know where to go put in a pole and run a wire and put in a 10 meter and that kind of thing. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I guess the other 12 question is, I don't think U.G.R.A. would have had the 13 authority to go onto that property to see what was going on. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I -- I've got that 15 one. Let me read just a little bit further in the same 16 paragraph. 17 MR. LUCAS: Second to last sentence. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. It says the -- 19 it says the report comes weekly to the Judge, the -- and 20 that shall be forwarded to the authorized agent. In our 21 case, we have a Designated Representative. We have 22 jurisdiction over an area in which the address is included. 23 The authorized agent -- that's us -- and our Designated 24 Representative acting for us, may use the list for the 25 purpose of implementing and enforcing rules under this 78 1 chapter. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can't trespass, 3 though. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Uh-huh. Got one for 5 that, too. 6 MR. LUCAS: Probable cause. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It may take me a 8 minute, but there is a separate law that regards that, and 9 it's in my book. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, what would be a 11 neat thing to do, and we've had this discussion very briefly 12 before, this exact same one, when the Judge gets it and 13 sends it over to U.G.R.A., to also send to it the Appraisal 14 District. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: We do. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You do send it over 17 there? 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yes. If somebody wants to 19 see those, those are the latest two. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can we hire somebody 21 to come here and turn the air-conditioner down a little bit? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be nice. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, it would be 24 nice. Do an interlocal agreement, hire three or four 25 lawyers. Sheriff, just shoot that thing. Thank you. 79 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have you sent a copy 2 over to the Designated Representative, or do they get one? 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: We will. 4 MR. BARRON: I had a question on that one. 5 What would be a timely manner for them to get a septic 6 system installed? And if it's not installed in that 7 timeframe, what kind -- are we going to take legal action 8 against them, or -- 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: We don't have any authority 10 to involve ourselves in that. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No, it's whether or 12 not it's creating a nuisance or hazard to public health, and 13 that's the only question you can ask. That's either -- 366 14 and 285 both. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That may be a way for 16 U.G.R.A. to be a -- a positive act. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Sure. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And say, you know, "Here 19 is the information needed to apply for a septic system, 20 since you have a new residence." 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: This specifically -- 22 the language, when I find it, specifically relates to new 23 service out there. 24 (Discussion off the record.) 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Actually, this is 80 1 titled "Right to Enter" -- I'll find it. Go on. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I mean, I think the 3 bottom line to this is that we can provide information to 4 U.G.R.A. as to hookups, and if U.G.R.A., in its normal 5 operations, determines that there's waste or nuisance, 6 they're polluting the environment, then they have the 7 authority already, within the state statutes, to take action 8 to prevent the pollution. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This list also is for 10 information purposes. I mean, it gives a description of 11 what it's for. That was another concern I had, whether it's 12 a well or -- I mean, so they don't be chasing things that 13 aren't -- and this says what the purpose of the meter is. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Hey, I will get this 16 reference; I think it's in my backup file. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, sure. Right. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: But it says -- it says 19 the right to enter private property for enforcement of this 20 rule, or these kinds of rules. You can -- you can enter. 21 MR. LUCAS: It's tantamount to, like, having 22 probable cause. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. It's -- 24 MR. LUCAS: To do that, right. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Seems like the -- 81 1 well, the old landfill law, you have to be able to see it 2 from a public road or something before you enter the 3 property and those kinds of things. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll get it. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you this 6 question. Back in the olden days, it was suggested, when 7 Lane Walker -- Lane Wolters was around, that -- that you -- 8 you did take your gray water and run it out onto the ground. 9 You did not run it into your septic system, you simply ran a 10 hose out there and let it water your yard. And, I've 11 heard -- and the last few days, I've heard several people 12 talking, "Oh, my god, we're all going to jail for letting 13 our gray water out in the yard," and you've mentioned it a 14 couple of times. What's the problem with gray water? Or, 15 maybe, what is the definition of gray water? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think that's 17 better. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I can tell you exactly 19 what it is. Used to include things like you could run water 20 out of your sink in the kitchen and the -- and out of the 21 washing machine. That has since been changed. The only 22 gray water that you can discharge on the ground now is out 23 of a washing machine, period. Not out of a shower, not out 24 of your sink in the kitchen, anything else. The only thing 25 you can -- that classifies as gray water now is washing 82 1 machine, and you can put that on the ground and water plants 2 with it or -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Clothes washing or 4 dishwashing? 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Clothes washing. It 6 says "laundry." 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But diapers can't be in 8 there. Doesn't it say something about diapers? 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: We're getting a bit far 10 afield here, gentlemen. Anything else on this agenda item, 11 specifically? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you for the 13 discussion. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Travis. 15 MR. LUCAS: Okay. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moving on to Item Number 9, 17 consider and discuss changing F.L.S.A. status on job 18 description for the Information Systems Support Specialist. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: From nonexempt to exempt. 21 Commissioner Griffin. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: At the time we 23 processed in court the job description for the computer -- 24 for the Information Systems Support Specialist, I made a 25 mistake in drafting that. I had used the format that I was 83 1 given that came out of the study. It happened to have 2 nonexempt in there, and I didn't catch that in the format, 3 and it should have been exempt. This is an exempt position, 4 and this action is just to correct that. And, I would make 5 a motion that we change the F.L.S.A. status from nonexempt 6 to exempt. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 9 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 10 change the F.L.S.A. status on the job description for the 11 Information Systems Support Specialist from nonexempt to 12 exempt. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 13 favor, raise your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can we inquire of the 19 Commissioner where we are on this project? 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Almost there. We've 21 got a meeting sometime today, a short meeting of the 22 committee, and hope to have some word on that. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Next item is Item Number 10, 24 consider and discuss approving resolution proclaiming May 25 3rd, Year 2001, as National Day of Prayer. We did this last 84 1 year, I believe, and it's once again requested that 2 Commissioners Court pass a resolution declaring May 3rd as 3 National Day of Prayer. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz 7 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve a 8 resolution proclaiming National Day of Prayer as May 3rd, 9 Year 2001. Any further questions or comments? If not, all 10 in favor, raise your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 15 11, consider and discuss approval of payment of $171.75 for 16 a thermabind machine from excess funds in District Clerk's 17 Capital Outlay item. Linda Uecker. 18 MS. UECKER: Good morning. How are y'all? 19 Is it still morning? It is. I just need to redirect some 20 of the Capital Outlay funds for a thermabind machine that 21 was an emergency I had to purchase, and realized later that 22 that was not part of the Capital Outlay funds. And, it's a 23 machine that binds together the appeals that go to the -- 24 the transcripts that go to the Court of Appeals, and ours 25 broke and we couldn't get it repaired, so I bought a new 85 1 one. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And you had excess funds? 3 I mean -- 4 MS. UECKER: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- it was an emergency 6 purchase? So moved. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 10 seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court approve 11 utilization by the District Clerk of $171.75 for the 12 purchase of a thermabind machine -- 13 MS. UECKER: Thank you. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- from her Capital Outlay 15 account. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 16 favor, raise your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How are your new offices? 22 MS. UECKER: Wonderful. Oh, did you see the 23 table? 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Everybody go up and see 25 Linda's table with the old pictures on it. It's really 86 1 neat. 2 MS. UECKER: One of the old courtroom tables. 3 It's out in the foyer; you need to go up and look at it. 4 Okay. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thanks, Linda. 6 MS. UECKER: Thank you. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Next item we'll take up is 8 actually Item Number 19, which was on the amended addendum 9 to the agenda. It is consider and discuss approval of four 10 Certificates of Substantial Completion relating to the 11 courthouse annex renovation and authorize the County Judge 12 to sign same. Keith Longnecker. Do you want to come 13 forward and walk us through these, please? 14 MR. LONGNECKER: Okay. I'm Keith Longnecker. 15 Thank you for having me here to go through this substantial 16 completion. At this point, City of Kerrville has issued a 17 Certificate of Occupancy for the permitted occupancy of 18 those areas of the courthouse, both 3A and 3B phases, which 19 is the annex portion and this portion over here, with the 20 exception of those unfinished areas in the lower level. 21 Everything else, we do have a permanent occupancy permit. 22 So, these four items: Second floor, 3 -- east end, 3B, that 23 has permanent occupancy and is complete. Partial first 24 floor, lower level, 3A, partial occupancy. That is actually 25 the existing occupancy that was there before any 87 1 construction began on the annex portion. Partial second 2 floor, west end courthouse, that's the new Law Library, and 3 that is finished. And then partial exterior annex 4 courthouse. Those are all complete, with the exception of 5 punch list items. Punch list items are nearly complete. 6 There's a few HVAC problems, maybe a loose wire on suspended 7 ceilings. Again, very minor items. Some painting items 8 that the contractor is working on to complete. He hopes to 9 be finished by Wednesday, with the exception of something 10 that we don't know about. 11 The substantial completion, as far as the -- 12 it is ready to be signed and issued. You all have copies of 13 that, I believe. As far as the brick mortar, which was at 14 the last meeting, that problem seems to be resolved. The 15 coming off of the sand, the mortar, was a result of 16 overcleaning with muriatic acid, which causes what's called 17 a burning of the mortar in the industry. And, this does not 18 really hurt the mortar, doesn't hurt the hardness of it. It 19 doesn't hurt the -- or cause it to do any problem. I asked 20 Dean Mitchell of Mitchell Masonry, who's an expert in 21 masonry work in this area, along with myself, had determined 22 that it would not be necessary to go into extension -- 23 extensive testing, which would cost the County some $5,900 24 to bring Drash Engineering out here and go through a lot of 25 expensive testing, which I do not feel would be necessary. 88 1 I would recommend that we don't do that. So, that problem, 2 I feel, has been resolved. That mortar should be as good 3 and last as long as it did or has in this -- this particular 4 building, which was built in 1926. I think we could depend 5 on it that long or longer. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Does anyone have any 7 questions of Keith over these four Certificates of 8 Substantial Completion? 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It's your 10 recommendation that we go ahead and -- 11 MR. LONGNECKER: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I will so move. 13 MR. LONGNECKER: Let me clarify a few things 14 that might help you in your decision. We are at 100 percent 15 completion, as far as the construction work itself is 16 considered, but we still retain 10 percent of the overall 17 contract, which means we will -- he will -- the contractor 18 will submit an application for payment to bring it to 90 19 percent. And, then, until we have the construction manual, 20 until the work drawings are complete, we will not release 21 any of those -- balance of that retainage until such time as 22 we determine that everything is final and complete. But, 23 this is what -- just what it says; it's substantial 24 completion. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We've still got a 89 1 little hammer on it. So, I'll make a motion that we approve 2 the Certificates of Substantial Completion as submitted, and 3 authorize the County Judge to sign same. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 6 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 7 approve the four Certificates of Substantial Completion 8 submitted and authorize the County Judge to sign same. Any 9 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 10 your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Thank you, 15 Keith. 16 MR. LONGNECKER: Okay. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Court will now shortly go 18 into Executive Session. I'll remind everyone, before we do, 19 that we have a 2 o'clock public hearing on O.S.S.F. rules, 20 and then we have a scheduled agenda item at 4 o'clock for 21 the first assessment on redistricting. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, on item 2.18, 23 consider and discuss role of Citizens Advisory Committee, do 24 you want to do that when that committee is here, or just 25 prior -- 90 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yes, we'll do that then. So, 2 the Court will now move into Executive Session, and those 3 who are not required are so excused. 4 (The open session was closed at 11:08 a.m., and an Executive Session was held, the 5 transcript of which is contained in a separate document.) 6 - - - - - - - - - - 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: The Court, having concluded 8 its Executive Session, is returned to open session. There 9 being no business required as a result of Executive Session, 10 Commissioners Court will stand in recess until 2 o'clock 11 p.m. this afternoon. 12 (Recess taken from 11:15 a.m. until 2 p.m.) 13 - - - - - - - - - - 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: It is 2 o'clock p.m. on the 15 afternoon of Monday, April 23rd. We will reconvene this 16 special regular session of the Kerr County Commissioners 17 Court. First item for business in this session is to 18 conduct a public hearing on proposed amendment to Kerr 19 County O.S.S.F. order regarding property transfer 20 inspections and procedures. 21 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 2:01 p.m., and a public hearing 22 was held in open court, as follows:) 23 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: A copy of the order, as 25 accepted by the Court, has been on file with the County 91 1 Clerk's office and was available there for inspection by the 2 public. We've had a couple people sign up to address us. 3 Let's start with Bill Stacy. Mr. Stacy? I'd like -- before 4 Mr. Stacy starts, I want to emphasize that this is a posted 5 item for discussion on the amendment only. The amendment 6 only relates to transfer -- inspection upon transfer. Other 7 topics are not on the agenda for today's discussion. So, 8 Judge Stacy? 9 MR. STACY: Thank you, Judge. I would like 10 to make a remark in -- if the Court approves the use of 11 these aerobic systems, that the Court put on there as an 12 addendum that there be a bond posted, because it's my 13 understanding that the problem with the aerobic systems is, 14 over a period of time, the homeowner that has bought the 15 system has let it slide, the service of it, and then the -- 16 the installer that put it in is gone, and they're -- you 17 have a failing aerobic system. So I think that, obviously, 18 you don't need it if you have the old conventional system 19 that -- that I espouse, but on the aerobic systems, you've 20 got to have some way that that machinery is serviced after 21 the installation of it and down through the years, or else 22 you're going to have another failing system and an unhappy 23 camper. I just want to throw that out there for you. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay, thank you. Charles 25 Wiedenfeld? 92 1 MR. WIEDENFELD: Good afternoon. Charles 2 Wiedenfeld, Kerr County Designated Representative for the 3 O.S.S.F. program. And, I would -- I'll have several 4 comments, and I think that I'll -- I was attempting to stray 5 from the directions given by the County Judge, and I'll 6 follow the lead of Mr. Stacy. But, anyways, in addressing 7 the issue that's before the Court today, my comment is on -- 8 that, you know, more stringent standards, as well as -- I 9 feel are equally important, as well as several other 10 standards that are, I feel, equally important to the 11 protection of the health of Kerr County citizens. I would 12 like -- that's what I would like to present today. 13 And, anyways, first of all, I support the 14 proposed rule of inspecting O.S.S.F.'s at the time of 15 property sale. This has been and will continue to prove a 16 valuable function of the Kerr County government. Even in 17 our modern living, there's been many serious health 18 violations, and I suspect that they will continue to be 19 present and will continue to develop, especially with the 20 low income residents that we have in the county. However, 21 as proposed, the provisions that are in there, I do 22 recommend removing all procedural and administrative aspects 23 of this standard, leaving just the requirement for 24 inspection and licensing of an O.S.S.F. at the time of 25 ownership to the property. Everything other than that is -- 93 1 makes it very arbitrary and ambiguous to the Designated 2 Representative, who is out there trying to inspect a septic 3 system. 4 As I have mentioned before, there's only one 5 solution that should take place, and is -- should be 6 understood, and is understood by most people -- sellers of 7 property, is that at the time of sale, if this system has 8 not been licensed previously by Kerr County, that it will be 9 a licensed septic system. No ifs, ands, or buts. No 10 looking under this, checking for this, no making a judgment 11 call here, making a judgment call there. Those are very -- 12 like I said, very arbitrary. Each -- each inspection is 13 unique in itself. No two systems are alike, and it just 14 makes it very difficult for the D.R., and eventually to the 15 County Commissioners, in that y'all catch the flak for 16 having rules that are very ambiguous. Again, I think a very 17 simple structure, kind of like the old rules were: At the 18 time of sale a septic system will be inspected, and if, upon 19 the inspection, finds that there's an unlicensed system, 20 that it must be licensed. 21 Okay. The second comment I have, and this is 22 in relation to what y'all have proposed today, is that I 23 still believe that all septic systems on all properties 24 should be licensed, regardless of the property size. We 25 have -- 94 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's -- that does not 2 appear to pertain to inspections on transfers, so let's -- 3 MR. WIEDENFELD: Doesn't appear to, but it is 4 my understanding, with y'all's proposed rule you have today, 5 is that that rule is and does pertain to all septic systems 6 within Kerr County. And, my point being -- is that if we're 7 going to have to go back two years later, when a piece of 8 property sells, after somebody has put in a septic system 9 and now make a judgment call as to if this system can be 10 licensed or not, we cannot do that. It has to be licensed 11 at the time of installation and inspected at the time of 12 installation, and that is the only time we can license 13 the -- the system. Chapter 366 is very explicit in saying 14 that we must be able to see the components of that septic 15 system and we cannot license anything that has not been 16 seen. And that's every component, every portion of that 17 septic system. And thus, I -- again, I'm urging the Court 18 to consider that all septic systems be licensed. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: I'm going to say it one more 20 time. We're here to talk about inspections on transfers, 21 and I'm not going to permit us to stray very far from that 22 topic, because, one, it's posted that way, and secondly, 23 that's the desire of this Court. 24 MR. WIEDENFELD: I felt like it was related, 25 in that you will be addressing that issue in the -- in this 95 1 provision. And, again, my other comment was going to do 2 with aerobic septic systems, which, again, they are part of 3 a property transfer, but -- and my comment was -- to y'all 4 was that we're just -- we should be taking a very -- closer 5 look at having more stringent standards when it comes to 6 aerobic septic systems in Kerr County, because we have a -- 7 a very large amount of nutrient loading that's going to our 8 streams. And, we -- we did not allow that to happen with 9 the City of Kerrville wastewater plant. They have chosen to 10 have nutrient removal and a very low organic loading to 11 streams, and we have somehow allowed the State to let us 12 believe that aerobic units are treating wastewater to 13 something that we find susceptible -- acceptable in Kerr 14 County. Thank you. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Mr. Brown, Jim 16 Brown. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Judge, I need to step 18 out to get a document. 19 MR. BROWN: Commissioners, my name -- for the 20 record, my name is Jim Brown, General Manager of the Upper 21 Guadalupe River Authority, and I'm here today not only to 22 speak on behalf of the -- of the item on the agenda, but 23 would like to take this opportunity to say, for those who 24 have not been a part of this process, that -- that this 25 discussion today is -- is a result of Kerr County 96 1 Commissioners and U.G.R.A. working together. Without the -- 2 without the real estate inspection, the problem that 3 U.G.R.A. was facing is the -- the addressing the con -- the 4 contractual relationships that we have with another division 5 of T.N.R.C.C. under the Clean Rivers Act. And, I think -- I 6 think if I don't say this, I know that the Court will not 7 pump its own drum, but I wanted to extend to the Court our 8 appreciation for all the hard work and the numerous hours 9 and many meetings that the committee from this Court and the 10 committee from U.G.R.A. conducted and held in order to get 11 us where we are today. Thank you. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Is there anyone 13 else who'd like to address the Court on the issue of septic 14 system inspections at time of transfer of real estate? 15 Anyone else? Seeing no one else, we'll -- 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I have a letter from 17 Mr. Lane Wolters, who could not be here today, that he asked 18 be made part of the record. It's some input that he had. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Without any objection, we'll 20 make the letter from Mr. Wolters a part of the record today. 21 Anything else? If not, this concludes the public hearing. 22 (The public hearing was concluded at 2:10 p.m., and the regular Commissioners Court 23 meeting was reopened.) 24 - - - - - - - - - - 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: We will now reconvene the 97 1 regular special session of the Commissioners Court and take 2 up Item Number 13, which is consider and discuss approval of 3 the amendment to the Kerr County O.S.S.F. order regarding 4 property transfer inspections and procedures. Commissioner 5 Griffin. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: All right. For 7 everyone assembled, let's -- I would like to quickly review 8 the bidding on how we got to where we are and how we will 9 proceed. As we have discussed amongst the committees that 10 Mr. Brown mentioned, we talked about the flow of authority 11 and -- and responsibility for water quality and making sure 12 that we don't have septic systems that create public 13 nuisance or hazards to health, in that they're properly 14 distanced from wells and property lines and so on. And, 15 that -- that flow goes from Chapter 366, Health and Safety 16 Code, to Chapter 285 of the Administrative Code of Section 17 -- of Chapter 30 of the Administrative Code, and then that 18 flows to our rule, which is a further implementation of how 19 we take care of 285 and 366. 20 Now, the one thing that we've talked about, 21 and one of the things that goes along with -- a little bit 22 with what Mr. Wiedenfeld was talking about, is that we will 23 try to keep this amendment regarding property transfers as 24 short and sweet as we can to implement what 285 tells us we 25 have to do, and what T.N.R.C.C. will buy off on and approve, 98 1 and keep it as brief as possible. And then, what -- and we 2 haven't gotten universal understanding and support for this 3 yet, but that -- I really think that, coming out of our 4 rule, then, needs to be a detailed procedures document that 5 will be -- that will be prepared primarily by our Designated 6 Representative, but approved by this Court, that says, yes, 7 indeed, these procedures and processes will implement what 8 we and the State have said we want to do. 9 And, there can be any level of detail, 10 because that's our document; that's our Kerr County 11 document. There can be whatever level of detail we want in 12 that document, and we can change it any time we want to if 13 we see a better procedure or process that we can follow, so 14 that this is not the final word, is what I'm saying. If 15 there are pieces that we need to address in our procedures 16 document on how we implement this rule, we can discuss that, 17 or we can include that in excruciating detail, if that's 18 what we want to do. And, in some cases we should, because 19 that's what -- and we want to have something that we can 20 hand to John Q. Public that says, "Here is the process that 21 you are entering into and here's how it's going to be 22 handled." And so that two inspectors, for example, would 23 come out with the same result if they did independent 24 inspections. That document ought to be done in enough 25 detail that, if two separate inspectors went out 99 1 independently, did a site survey, a site inspection, they 2 would come to the same conclusion as to what the technical 3 requirements are to put an O.S.S.F. there, whether it's a 4 standard system or some alternative to that. 5 Over the last couple of weeks, I have gone 6 through our proposed rule, as we posted for this hearing, 7 and I have done some tweaking to that -- proposed tweaking 8 to it based on input from T.N.R.C.C., to make sure that we 9 implemented what they saw the requirements of 366 and 285 10 being, and understanding -- and they very well understand 11 what we are trying to do, as far as getting inspections at 12 the time of real estate transfer. What I would like to do, 13 Judge, today, is I would like to offer, in the form of a 14 substitute, an amendment which is actually -- I actually 15 reaccomplished the whole order, the whole proposed order, so 16 that we would have it in one single document. I would 17 propose that -- that we accept this substitute, that we not 18 act on it today; we'll wait until our next session, put this 19 back on for a vote on whether or not we want to adopt this. 20 That will give everybody on -- both on the Court and in the 21 public, plenty of time to look at it. We do not have to 22 have another public hearing, but we will have a chance for 23 everybody to get a look at the document as substituted, and 24 we can delay a vote until next go-around. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Why don't you just take a 100 1 couple of minutes, Commissioner, and just run through the 2 general nature of the changes that will be reflected in the 3 substitute. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: In what T.N.R.C.C. 5 had -- and, actually, I got some of this from -- from our 6 Designated Representative, as well. There were some 7 licenses issued back in the '80's, the mid- to late '80's, 8 after the very first T.N.R.C.C. rule came out, and some of 9 those licenses are sort of squishy as to what were the 10 standards that they were licensed to. So that even those 11 that were pre-1992 -- we've got pretty good confidence in 12 the licenses that were issued after Kerr County had its 13 initial rule in October of '92. What this -- so, one minor 14 change -- it's a minor change -- is that at least there is a 15 detailed administrative review of systems licensed prior to 16 October of '92. That's pretty simple. It didn't require 17 much of a change to the document, but that it was 18 significant as far as both T.N.R.C.C. and our Designated 19 Representative were concerned. 20 The other changes were primarily not really 21 changes to what we posted for the public hearing, but as 22 some clarification, it probably added a total of 2 inches of 23 verbiage to that -- to the posted document. But, what this 24 does is lays out exactly what happens more precisely for 25 guidance purposes, 'cause we'll put the detail in that 101 1 follow-on document that I mentioned a while ago. But, what 2 this does is that it -- it addresses an unlicensed system, a 3 previously unlicensed system, a system licensed prior to 4 '92, and a system that was licensed after '92, and this just 5 gives a little more guidance. That made T.N.R.C.C. feel 6 comfortable that we weren't going to license a system that 7 was previously unlicensed, unless we did everything that was 8 necessary to bring it up to current standards. 9 But you don't have to do that, according to 10 T.N.R.C.C. -- and I know Charlie Wiedenfeld and I have a 11 little difference on this. I have been convinced by 12 T.N.R.C.C. that there is a way not to have to go and license 13 unlicensed systems, but we can get into that later. But, 14 this incorporates what T.N.R.C.C. says, clarifies for them 15 and their legal department that we are going -- we are not 16 doing anything in here that's outside the bounds of 285, and 17 that's really the nature of it. It doesn't really change 18 the essence of what's in the posted document. This is 19 better language, I hope. And, I've talked to them as early 20 as this morning, and they have reviewed it, and they said -- 21 or as late as this morning. They said that T.N.R.C.C. had 22 reviewed it; they thought we were there. They said that 23 they would now give it to their legal department while we're 24 doing this two-week review. Internally, they will also run 25 it by their legal people and see if there's anything that 102 1 they can catch that we may want to know about, and if so, 2 they would advise us. So, that's where we are. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Question. 4 Commissioner, you made reference in your opening comments to 5 the need for an addition to the transfer language, the need 6 for a separate procedures document. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Mm-hmm. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In your mind, that 9 addresses the concerns of Mr. Wolters' letter? 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think it does. I 11 think it does. Actually, we had mentioned that very briefly 12 before in the previous hearings, and some time ago, about 13 how that would be approached, and I don't think Mr. Wolters 14 was here for that. But, this is not the be-all, end-all. 15 This is not a -- this is not what an inspector or apprentice 16 or anyone else would have in-hand that would actually go out 17 to do an inspection. This is not the document he would 18 have. We want to give him more guidance than that. And, I 19 really think -- and I'll jump ahead here just a little bit. 20 I think the way that document should be produced is that our 21 D.R., our Designated Representative, should be in charge of 22 putting that document together; however, I think he should 23 work very closely with the Court. I certainly will be glad 24 to help and do whatever we can, but I think it should be 25 under the primary -- actually formatting, putting it 103 1 together, should be the Designated Representative's 2 responsibility. And then, at some point, when we're 3 satisfied that the document says what it ought to say, this 4 Court would approve it and make it effective. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner, do you 6 think that this inspection standards and procedures document 7 that you're talking about, can that be done and brought back 8 so that we can adopt this whole thing at one time? 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That may be ambitious, 10 but this gives us enough to get started. We can conduct -- 11 and we may start out with an outline, and this is the 12 thought -- I have not even discussed this with our 13 Designated Representative yet, but I think we can quickly 14 get to the meat of what an inspection has to be. We can go 15 ahead and start making inspections as soon as T.N.R.C.C. 16 approves our rule, 'cause we would have to get that done 17 first. That may take another week or two after we approve 18 it. So, I think by -- certainly, by the time that 19 T.N.R.C.C. approves our new rule, we would have enough time 20 to be able to at least get the first cut of that document 21 done, where it would be a working document, and this Court 22 could approve it. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Would these standards 24 become a part of Section 10? 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No. 104 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, it's -- 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's the beauty of 3 it. And T.N.R.C.C. went along with this, so that we don't 4 have to go back and change this rule. Every time we want to 5 tweak an inspection procedure, we can do that in our 6 document and we don't have to go back to T.N.R.C.C., as long 7 as we don't go outside the bounds of the rule that they 8 approve. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, it just seems to 10 me that if -- to me, as a representative of the public, if I 11 vote to adopt a Section 10, I would also want to adopt the 12 procedures at the same time so that they'll know -- or so 13 I'll know what, really, I'm adopting. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Uh-huh. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's just my point 16 of view. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. But this is 18 saying -- this, in essence, is saying to go adopt that other 19 document. It's saying go do that. There's nothing in here 20 that would -- that would change if you changed what we put 21 in that procedures document. We can change that and we 22 don't change this at all. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's how it's 25 designed, or at least I hope it works out that way. 105 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- what I'm 2 hearing Commissioner Baldwin say, and I think I share the 3 opinion -- I mean, I'm reluctant to -- even though we're not 4 going to vote on this today, but voting on it the next time, 5 until we have -- I hate to put U.G.R.A. in a situation where 6 we have a new approved order and don't have a procedures, 7 'cause they're going to be in between orders again, which we 8 had last time. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. Also -- and, 10 oh, I should mention that T.N.R.C.C. did buy the suggestion 11 that I think we had discussed here in court, that we can 12 make that -- this new rule effective on a certain date by 13 asking them to not sign it until that date. The law 14 specifically says when it's signed, it's effective. But 15 they will be quite happy, if we want to delay that to a time 16 certain, once they've gone through the approval process, 17 they will delay the signing until the date we tell them we 18 want it signed. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the time period 20 for them once we submit it to them? A week to 10 days? 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I suspect this one 22 will go through a little quicker than the last one did, 23 because I've done a lot more coordination on this one than 24 the last one. So, they've already got the -- the 25 amendment -- the substitute. They've already got that, and 106 1 they've said they can't really find anything wrong. They're 2 a little bit worried about one word, and I said, "Give me 3 another word," you know, "we'll put it in." But, anyway, 4 the -- I suspect it would be a couple -- a week or two. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Couple weeks? 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: They have to run it 7 through their legal department, they have to run it through 8 a staffing procedure, and then it goes to the Executive 9 Director for his signature. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think, conceptually, I 11 would rather hold off till we had the procedures as well, 12 just from the standpoint I think it is easier -- I would 13 hate to have this come back approved before we have 14 procedures. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that would be a 17 bad situation, 'cause then we're going to have a -- kind of, 18 "What are we going under now?" Sure as anything, we'll have 19 20 applications that day, and then we're going to be -- you 20 know. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think by the time we 22 would be ready to tell T.N.R.C.C. to approve this rule, we 23 should have that document. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let me make a suggestion. 25 When we bring it back next meeting or whenever, we could 107 1 request that our Designated Representative give us a 2 timeframe within which he would expect to have the 3 procedures manual ready for us to act on. Then we can 4 perhaps coordinate the approval date by T.N.R.C.C. with that 5 procedures manual timeframe. At least we'd have an idea 6 then, when we came to vote on it, where -- how the time -- 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And, by the way, this 8 procedures document, as I see it -- and correct me if I'm 9 wrong out there, D.R., but -- but this is not a -- this is 10 not this kind of document, it's this kind of document. It 11 spells out what the separate categories are and what you 12 look for in the case of an unlicensed system, a licensed 13 system, and so on. It's not -- this is not a long-winded 14 document. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not a textbook. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Not a textbook. It is 17 a procedures outline -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Has work begun on 19 that yet? 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- one, two, three, 21 four. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Has work begun on it? 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right there it has, 24 but far as I know, we haven't put it in -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, why can't you 108 1 ask him that question right now? How long is it going to 2 take him to put the document together? Do you want me to 3 ask him? 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Why don't you ask him, 5 Commissioner? 6 MR. BROWN: If I may address the Court 7 again -- Jim Brown, General Manager of U.G.R.A. -- 8 Commissioner Griffin and I have had some conversations. 9 Commissioner Letz was a part of that conversation about this 10 particular document. To my knowledge, I've not discussed it 11 with the Designated Representative. And, also, understand 12 that -- that we'll be changing Designated Representatives 13 within the next 15 to 20 days, as Mr. Wiedenfeld retires. 14 If we could have an outline, just a rough outline so we can 15 start pulling information together, we can expedite that. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 17 MR. BROWN: I would like to see us move as 18 fast as we can, because there's some things happening out in 19 the county with the old O.S.S.F. systems today that we're 20 going to have some problems with down in the future. 21 They're -- most of our installers play the game by the 22 rules, but we've got some folks who are not doing it, and 23 they're taking advantage of this hiatus that we're in at 24 this time. So, we'll do what we can do expedite it. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Let me also say that I 109 1 -- I can take on as an action item -- as an action item to 2 get with our Designated Representative and others in 3 U.G.R.A., and I think we can come up with something, 4 certainly by the time that this is going to come up for 5 adoption, which would be at least one court session from 6 now. I think we can come up with something that you'll feel 7 comfortable with, as far as the procedures and processes, 8 that could be approved at the same time. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That solves it. That 10 basically solves it. The other comment I have is that -- 11 you know, and I support the concept of the plan as outlined 12 here. The only concern I have is under -- and it may have 13 changed in the new draft, but under -- in Section 10(5)b, 14 it's "Evaluate the O.S.S.F. for signs of failure which 15 preclude the system from meeting the purposes stated in 16 Section 285. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Translate that? What 18 that translates to, if you read 285.1, is that it says 19 there's no public health hazard being created, there is no 20 nuisance condition being created, and that the setbacks and 21 separations are all in accordance with Table 10, which means 22 that you've got -- you don't have wells within certain 23 distances, you're not within certain distances of property 24 lines and those kinds of things. That's all -- that's 25 really all that means. 110 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And the reason that is 3 worded no stronger than that is because then that gives 4 us -- that gives all of us the ability to determine what we 5 think from a technical point of view, from a reasonableness 6 point of view, from a fairness point of view, how far do you 7 need to test? How far do you need to inspect? How invasive 8 do you have to be? We can determine that then. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's just when we get to 10 the procedures, that is the one word in this whole document 11 that concerns me, because "failure" -- it is not defined, 12 and we need to make sure that whatever the procedures 13 document says, it's not something that can be arbitrary or 14 as little -- I guess as least subjective as possible. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. And, by the 16 way, T.N.R.C.C. says they would be glad to help us word that 17 document where they felt comfortable with it, which I 18 think -- and we ought to take them up on that to keep them 19 in the process as we develop a document. Because, like I 20 said, they'd be willing to help. They know what we're 21 trying to do, and if they've got any technical ability to 22 help us or whatever, they would be glad to pitch in, and I 23 think we should take them up on it. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Larry, in your new 25 draft with that Subsection B that Commissioner Letz made 111 1 reference to, (5)b, will there be a reference in that to the 2 inspection procedures document? 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That seems to be an 5 ideal place to have one. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No, T.N.R.C.C. 7 didn't -- they said you can't, in the rule, refer to a 8 document that's downstream. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: 'Cause I said I wanted 11 to make a one-sentence amendment to 10 -- for Section 10 12 that would just say, Inspections will occur on real estate 13 transfer in accordance with Kerr County -- blah, blah, blah; 14 refer to the document. That would have been it. Then we 15 put everything in our document. They wouldn't buy that. 16 They said you can't -- we can't -- that rule can't refer to 17 a downstream document. It can refer to an upstream 18 document, but -- well, there's a saying we have in the 19 military about certain things flowing, and you just can't 20 flow uphill. I mean, you can flow downhill, but can't flow 21 uphill. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions or 23 comments? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My only comment is to 25 Commissioner Letz. I just think one of the keys to this 112 1 whole thing is the definition of "failure." You know, 2 whether you -- whether you put it under the definition 3 section or however you do it, or if you do it in the 4 inspection standards and procedures, you know, whether 5 you -- regardless how you do it, I think that is one of the 6 keys, is that everyone understand what failure is. So 7 that when -- what's your name again? 8 MR. BROWN: Jim Brown. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. Okay, Jim. Back 10 there in the back. 11 MR. BARRON: Stuart. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Stuart goes out and 13 inspects -- I'm sorry -- goes out and inspects the thing, 14 and then Stuart, in three years, is gone from here and the 15 next guy comes along and understands clearly what the word 16 failure means. So that if -- 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If I may, there's -- 18 I've asked that question of T.N.R.C.C. And, unfortunately, 19 for right now, we have to define failure in terms of what we 20 can glean out of 366 and 285. However, there is light at 21 the end of the tunnel, in that the new 285 which is in the 22 works now will have specific definitions of failure. And I 23 said, "Bring it on." 'Cause that's what we need. And, 24 you're exactly right; in the short term, we're going to have 25 to pull language out of 366 and 285 that we can make work, 113 1 and that -- that's not easy, but I think we can do it. It 2 will get easier a little bit later on. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just think that's 4 the key to the whole thing. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And I don't know when 6 the new 285 is going to be out, but it -- I guess they're 7 through with all the review processes, are they not, Jim? 8 MR. BROWN: I think -- I think the comment 9 period is past. I'm not sure where they are in the internal 10 tweaking of those comments. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: But I would hope it's 12 straightening out some other things that are bad, because, 13 for example, there is no limit on the life of a permit, 14 except in situations that don't apply to Kerr County. So, 15 right now, we technically don't have a limit on how long a 16 permit's good for. And, I think their new language is going 17 to say either one year -- they were also looking at some 18 options that the counties can say one year, or come in and 19 if -- or if you want to extend beyond a year, that can be 20 done, but you have to contact us so we can reinspect the 21 site to make sure a well hasn't been drilled or something 22 right where the drainfield's going. So, anyway, that will 23 be in the new -- the new one's going to be better, I think. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask this 25 question now. The new 285, is that something that Train 114 1 Wreck is doing internally, or is that -- is the Legislature 2 dealing with the new one? 3 MR. BROWN: It's an internal document, but 4 please understand that last Thursday, T.N.R.C.C. -- it was 5 almost completely gutted by the House Natural Resources 6 Committee. I understand there's up to some 27 amendments to 7 their Sunset bill. So, they've got some internal problems, 8 and I wanted to lay that out, because when we -- when we 9 start looking at the new 285, we may run into some problems 10 as far as the timely delivery of that. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And the -- that goes a 12 little further with the answer to your question. Yes, it's 13 an internally-generated document, but they've had multiple 14 comment opportunities from statewide, other agencies, 15 counties, people. U.G.R.A. made comments to it. Then they 16 had a public hearing, I guess, where they did the same -- 17 went through some of that same kind of thing, but it's a -- 18 it's a well-engineered document, in that everybody's had a 19 shot at it, just about. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's one of those 21 agencies, I guess, that has their own rule-making authority. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No, 366 gives them 23 specific authority to write 285. It doesn't refer to it by 24 number; it says the Commission will write a rule that will 25 implement what we, the Legislature, say we want you to do in 115 1 366. So, that is a specific -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Larry, one other word 3 that strikes me as strange is in Section 10, Number (6). As 4 a result of the inspection outlined in (5) above -- or, "If, 5 as a result of inspection outlined in (5) above, 6 discrepancies are discovered..." Can we find a better word 7 than "discrepancies"? Maybe T.N.R.C.C. already did find a 8 better word than discrepancies. That's another one of 9 those. What's that mean? 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, "anomalies," you 11 could use. Or, actually, all that -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's worse. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That word probably is 14 worse. But, the point is -- is that there are discrepancies 15 between what 285 says you've got to do and what the 16 inspector finds; that's what you're noting. If -- if there 17 is something that's noncompliant, it is -- that is a 18 discrepancy with -- 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why not say 20 "noncompliant"? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think noncompliant is 22 better than discrepancy. If any component is found to be 23 noncompliant. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: By the way, I'm sure 25 we can -- there may be other word changes like that, that 116 1 we'll want to consider before we adopt it, but I would -- I 2 don't want to -- am I ready for a motion? 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anyone else who has any 4 questions or comments at this time? If not, I believe we're 5 ready to entertain a motion to substitute the new version of 6 the O.S.S.F. order for the one that has been on file. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's my motion. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're not approving it, 9 were just substituting? 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Just substituting, as 11 accepted. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 14 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 15 substitute the new version of the proposed O.S.S.F. order, 16 as accepted for public purposes. Any questions or comments? 17 Does everyone understand where we are? Have you clearly 18 marked on the new one, "substitute"? 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We can do that. It's 20 also got a different date on it, and draft date. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: If not, all in favor, raise 22 your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 117 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Will that document lay 3 in the Clerk's office? 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Put copies in our 7 boxes? 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes, I'll get some 9 copies made. In fact, will you make about, maybe -- 10 MS. SOVIL: Aren't you going to do some 11 changing on some of the language? 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Not now. 13 MS. SOVIL: Oh, I thought substitute -- this 14 is substituted. Then, if we have to -- 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We'll look at all 16 those kinds of amendments. There may be some minor wording 17 changes before we adopt it. This is just the substitute for 18 what was there. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is a new draft. 20 MS. SOVIL: Sure. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. If there's nothing 22 else on these agenda items, we will stand in recess until 23 4 o'clock, at which time we'll take up the various agenda 24 items on redistricting. Thank you all. 25 (Recess taken from 2:40 p.m. until 4 p.m.) - - - - - - - - - - 118 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 27th day of April, 8 2001. 9 10 11 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 12 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 13 Certified Shorthand Reporter 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25